UPDATE: Aircraft hit building at 71st and York Ave on East Side of Manhattan

Rush Limbaugh Show ^ | 10/11/06 | Rush Limbaugh

[nj_pilot]

Your defense of something you enjoy is understandable. But shrieking about it being like the right to bear arms is a reach. You might try presenting logical arguments as opposed to hyperventilating and resorting to the ad hominem. The "shrieking" was a tongue-in-cheek remark that failed to register. That said, there is a good comparison to be made between the knee-jerk and uninformed reactions to restrict VFR flight in the NYC VFR exclusions in response to a tragic accident that killed < 5 people and the similar calls for "stricter" gun control laws in the wake of high-profile shootings. Aren't they obvious?

[Concho]

Just as a matter of curiosity, what is your flying ability? Are you commercial? You sure seem down on General Aviation.....

[nevergore]

Some are missing your point which you took a while in this thread to get to....Too many GA pilots take their certificate for granted and do not maintain the level of proficiency required to handle emergencies or fly in high traffic/highly congested airspace.

As a private pilot with my own aircraft, I train extensively well beyond what my annual flight check requires. Currently I have a little over 2200 hours in my flight log so I speak from experience.

In my flying time, I experienced 3 serious in-flight emergencies due to equipment failure. All three times my wife and children were on board. Hence, I take my responsibility seriously.

If you were to propose better training and checks for GA pilots who fly in high density areas that may be a way to go but this incident is fairly isolated and is probably a bit of a knee jerk response in the absence of a ongoing problem. This would also be as foolish as proposing restricting the airspace.

A small plane crash generally is similar to a car wreck as far as damage is concerned and fatalities are usually restricted to those on board. Spectacular looking at times but as compared to the auto-wrecks that occurred in NYC today rather tame as to the extent of injuries and fatalities.

[Pukin Dog]

...but I could still get bit on the butt by the alligator of fate.

Knowing that is probably what keeps you safe. And I agree that many GA's are flying more than they can handle. I congradulate you on your extra training, and you know as well as I do that you are the exception, not the rule.

[RS]

"Next, you will be telling me how my GA views dont square with my own flying ability?"

Don't know about your flying abilities, but your selection of where you would prefer to crash seems to leave a lot of question about your survival abilities ...


(1212- "Burn in 60 seconds or drown in 5 minutes? " )

[WestVirginiaRebel]

Sorry if I'm late, but I have to wonder if this might have been a suicide? Also, re the ekjection story, I think that's one of those urban legends that happens in events like this-like the story about the firefighter who supposedly rode a piece of the World Trade Center like a surfboard all the way down and survived when the towers collapsed.

[CindyDawg]

Just so you all know, local news here in Houston is reporting that we are one of the cities over which jets (F-2's) have been issued.

What's this about? I haven't gone thru all off the thread yet but this looks like an accident?

[Pukin Dog]

I am a retired Navy pilot and instructor, and retired commercial pilot. I am not down on GA, I am down on GA pilots who are less than safe, and make it worse for those who are.

[Arkinsaw]

The "shrieking" was a tongue-in-cheek remark that failed to register. That said, there is a good comparison to be made between the knee-jerk and uninformed reactions to restrict VFR flight in the NYC VFR exclusions in response to a tragic accident that killed < 5 people and the similar calls for "stricter" gun control laws in the wake of high-profile shootings. Aren't they obvious?

I don't know that its knee-jerk. Its just a matter of non-aviation types finding out due to this accident. I must admit I am surprised that any individual can get in a plane and fly around the Statue of Liberty, especially unrestricted. We have guys who would love to do that with hostile intent.

Also, just creating restrictions does nothing...after all...it was illegal to seize commercial aircraft and fly them into buildings....but somebody didn't obey the restriction.

[Moose4]

Well, the NTSB agrees with you...from the report on Munson's crash:

"The National Transportation Safety Board determines that the probable cause of the accident was the pilot's failure to recognize the need for, and to take action to maintain, sufficient airspeed to prevent a stall into the ground during an attempted landing. The pilot also failed to recognize the need for timely and sufficient power application to prevent the stall during an approach conducted inadvertently without flaps extended. Contributing to the pilot's inability to recognize the problem and to take proper action was his failure to use the appropriate checklist and his nonstandard pattern procedures which resulted in an abnormal approach profile."

http://www.airdisaster.com/reports/ntsb/AAR80-02.pdf

}:-)4

[surelyclintonsbaddream]

No disrespect, but I sure hope so.

Go Cards!!!

[Pukin Dog]

I dont recall giving you my opinion on that question. Did I make a selection? I only demonstrated the difficult of making that decision in the second or two you might have in which to make it.

[conservative in nyc]

Sorry if I'm late, but I have to wonder if this might have been a suicide?

No.

Also, re the ekjection story, I think that's one of those urban legends that happens in events like this-like the story about the firefighter who supposedly rode a piece of the World Trade Center like a surfboard all the way down and survived when the towers collapsed.

That probably didn't happen. Both died near the building crash site, according to the mayor.

[nj_pilot]

Sorry if I'm late, but I have to wonder if this might have been a suicide?

It looked like it could have been a suicide, but if the reports of 2+ people onboard are true, its probably just an accident.

[Pukin Dog]

The only reason that I propose more restrictions on GA, is that it would be easier than imposing better training standards on GA pilots.

[Moose4]

Is it true that the most dangerous time of a GA pilot's "career" is not when they're a student, and not right after they get their private license, but after they get about 150-200 hours? Or right after they get their instrument rating? I've always read that, and I guess it makes sense.

}:-)4

[Pukin Dog]

Imagine that.....

Thanks.

[Pukin Dog]

That is true of all pilots, not just GA. It happens right around the time you start thinking you are hot $hit. The only reason that I am serious about this issue now, is because I remember what an idiot I was as a young pilot. I thought I knew everything when in reality, I didnt know squat. There is no easy way to convince someone that they are still a novice after the Navy paints their name on an airplane.

[Not A Snowbird]

An experienced pilot is a fool if they believe that flap settings are something that can be left for memory. There is a little thing called a 'checklist' to be used and you dont just skip it because you think you will remember, because you wont one time and you might die.

My husband, thank goodness, is a slave to his checklist. No matter how many hours he has, he always has his checklist out and uses it. Good man.

[Pukin Dog]

Gotta go, nice chatting with ya!