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The Human-Influenced Evolution of Dogs
Seed Magazine ^ | 18 July 2006 | Emily Anthes

Posted on 07/18/2006 9:06:26 AM PDT by PatrickHenry

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To: Reeses
It seems possible that if given enough time some type of ant would eventually take over the world, and kill off all resource competitors.

I think you should quit while you are behind on this one. You obviously know nothing about ants. Try reading some before digging your hole deeper.

181 posted on 07/19/2006 7:20:48 AM PDT by js1138 (Well I say there are some things we don't want to know! Important things!")
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To: colorcountry
I suppose, in exchange for the cat food we give him.

You obviously do not understand cats...

Your cat apparently believes you could not possibly survive without his assistance.. ( food contributions )

You are just a really big, helpless, adopted "kitten"...

182 posted on 07/19/2006 9:32:37 AM PDT by Drammach (Freedom... Not just a job, it's an adventure..)
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To: js1138
You seem to have a chip on your shoulder about human evolution that is in conflict with Darwin's Descent of Man but you haven't posted what.

Here's something I found interesting about Cro-Magnon at Wikipedia that supports my position. I'm not alone in my conclusions:

Analysis of the pathology of the skeletons shows that the humans of this time period led a physically tough life. In addition to infection, several of the individuals found at the shelter had fused vertebrae in their necks indicating traumatic injury, and the adult female found at the shelter had survived for some time with a skull fracture.

...

The Cro-Magnon likely came in contact with the Neanderthals, and is often credited to have caused or finalized the latter's extinction.

183 posted on 07/19/2006 9:32:56 AM PDT by Reeses
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To: Drammach

LOL...Can anyone really understand cats?


184 posted on 07/19/2006 9:40:30 AM PDT by colorcountry ( Run with scissors???? I can barely jog my memory)
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To: Reeses

You seem to have an unsupported theory that you're touting as fact.

Cro-Magnon men and Neanderthals seem to have overlapped in their distribution, but there's no evidence they really had much to do with each other.


185 posted on 07/19/2006 11:11:38 AM PDT by ahayes ("If intelligent design evolved from creationism, then why are there still creationists?"--Quark2005)
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To: ahayes

It's a supported theory. Fused vertebrae and skull fractures are evidence of intent to kill. Many human fossils show signs of skull damage and other trauma, and there are sometimes arrow or spear heads around. Modern humans come from a very violent and not so distant past. I think it's important to understand mankind's true nature. When schools teach natural selection, they should also teach the special case of high speed human evolution. The left embraces Darwin's ideas of natural selection but likes to pretend Darwin's Descent of Man book does not exist.


186 posted on 07/19/2006 11:42:31 AM PDT by Reeses
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To: Reeses
Modern humans come from a very violent and not so distant past.

Past?

Modern humans live in a violent present.The incipient WW III brewing in the Middle East, the brutality in modern developed cities, and genocides in the third world all support the hypothesis that violence is our reality, not our history. We've just found more efficient means than clubs and spears.

The left embraces Darwin's ideas of natural selection but likes to pretend Darwin's Descent of Man book does not exist.

Scientists don't treat Darwin's work as the beginning and end of knowledge, because science marches on. Darwin's work is no more discredited than that of Hypocrates or Pythagoras or Copernicus or Euclid or Newton or Einstein. They're not refuted or discredited, but refined. We've built on their foundations and moved forward.

187 posted on 07/19/2006 1:48:29 PM PDT by ReignOfError
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To: Reeses

Cro-Magnons were perfectly capable of killing other Cro-Magnons without the Neanderthals' help, and that's probably what happened because Cro-Magnons would have had higher intraspecies competition than interspecies. This can't be considered evidence of Cro-Magnon/Neanderthal warfare unless such injuries are absent in Cro-Magnon remains from areas that Neanderthals did not inhabit, and they aren't. Your theory is unsupported.


188 posted on 07/20/2006 7:53:55 AM PDT by ahayes ("If intelligent design evolved from creationism, then why are there still creationists?"--Quark2005)
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To: ahayes
The Neanderthals were intelligent and similar to us. Why did they die out? Global warming? Poor nutrition? What's your alternate theory? Also, why did ALL other hominids die out, except ONE? That is very unusual in nature. For example there are many species of monkeys, many variations of a theme, but only one surviving humanoid. Why is that? Using logic such as Occam's Razor, the most obvious answer is probably the correct one. Exotic theories of volcano eruptions, global warming, a virus that kills off all of its hosts including itself, an intelligent species that suddenly forgets how to find food, just doesn't add up as well. Also we have real-time daily evidence of the very violent, murderous nature of modern humans. If you have an idea that makes more sense I would like to hear it.
189 posted on 07/20/2006 9:21:09 AM PDT by Reeses
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Placemarker.


190 posted on 07/20/2006 6:00:12 PM PDT by PatrickHenry (The Enlightenment gave us individual rights, free enterprise, and the theory of evolution.)
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To: MarkeyD; f zero
"Marley and Me" drives me absolutely nuts.

The poor dog's breeder TRIED to talk this first-time dog-owning couple out of an extremely energetic field dog . . . to no avail. And then they didn't give him anything to do . . . so he FOUND stuff to do, and drove them nuts.

I have Marley's twin sister. The story begins the same way -- I went to buy a couch-potato house dog and wound up with a high-energy field dog who chose US. The difference is that we went to Plan "B" and put her into training at 12 weeks, and found her lots of energy-burning activities to do.

She is now five, a model citizen, multi-titled in Agility and in Hunting Retriever. I can take her anywhere. But I didn't just wring my hands and watch her destroy stuff.

191 posted on 07/20/2006 6:09:22 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother ((Ministrix of Ye Chase, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment)))
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To: MeanWestTexan
Perhaps I nipped them in the bud

.....*Elvis's voice* Thank You, very much....*/Elvis's voice*

192 posted on 07/20/2006 9:34:32 PM PDT by skinkinthegrass (Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get you....... :^)
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To: Reeses

Who can say? There is insufficient evidence. Probably we had something to do with it, but more likely it was encroaching on their territory and competing for food rather than hunting them all down. Neanderthals were not very culturally advanced. They had only primitive tools, lived in small groups, and did not travel far. Humans had the technological edge. No doubt the climate change did cause problems for them, making it easier for Cro-magnon to move in and changing prey species ranges. It was probably a combination of multiple factors.

There are many species of monkeys, but that's not just a genus you're looking at, but a larger group. There are many organisms that are the sole species in their genus, that doesn't mean they killed all the other members off. Did the African and Asian elephants conspire to kill all other elephants?

Oh, and Occam's Razor is not as you have depicted it.


193 posted on 07/21/2006 9:10:38 AM PDT by ahayes ("If intelligent design evolved from creationism, then why are there still creationists?"--Quark2005)
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To: ahayes
It was probably a combination of multiple factors.

That's not a useful theory. It has too many assumptions, including ones that are not confidently even a factor. From Wikipedia:

Occam's razor states that the explanation of any phenomenon should make as few assumptions as possible, eliminating those that make no difference in the observable predictions of the explanatory hypothesis or theory.

Although insufficient evidence to convict in a court of law exists today that the Cro-Magnons killed off the Neanderthals, the warring tribe theory is more probable than just attributing the Neanderthals extinction to a fuzzy combination of factors. Are you uncomfortable with the idea that modern man is a war maker by nature, that our high intelligence and social abilities are the result of a violent war making past and present? Do you have an unrelated personal belief that is in conflict with this idea?

194 posted on 07/22/2006 11:44:36 AM PDT by Reeses
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To: colorcountry

I hate it when the door's open, you sortof see them come in from outside out of the corner of your eye, but don't really look. Later, when they've been in for 30 minutes or so, you glance down and between your feet is the a$$ end of a rabbit, or squirrel, or bird, or field mouse.


195 posted on 07/22/2006 11:51:45 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog
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To: Reeses
You don't understand Occam's Razor.

Are you uncomfortable with the idea that modern man is a war maker by nature, that our high intelligence and social abilities are the result of a violent war making past and present? Do you have an unrelated personal belief that is in conflict with this idea?

I'm uncomfortable with baseless theories. There is no evidence that humans were responsible for the aggressive extermination of Neanderthals. From what we have seen of humans and extinction, the chief means is usually habitat destruction. It's more likely that humans encroached on Neanderthal territory and out-competed them for prey.

196 posted on 07/22/2006 3:39:42 PM PDT by ahayes ("If intelligent design evolved from creationism, then why are there still creationists?"--Quark2005)
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197 posted on 05/22/2010 9:49:18 AM PDT by SunkenCiv ("Fools learn from experience. I prefer to learn from the experience of others." -- Otto von Bismarck)
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198 posted on 05/22/2010 9:51:27 AM PDT by SunkenCiv ("Fools learn from experience. I prefer to learn from the experience of others." -- Otto von Bismarck)
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199 posted on 05/22/2010 10:37:21 AM PDT by SunkenCiv ("Fools learn from experience. I prefer to learn from the experience of others." -- Otto von Bismarck)
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