No (House Republicans vs. Senator Frist’s amnesty plan. )

National Review Online ^ | 5 June 2006 | Rep. Tom Tancredo

[jmc813]

Sad, but what does that have to do with avoiding Vietnam?

Which branch of the military did you serve in?

[PRND21]

Personally I truly hope McCain will make that choice.

Not I. But at least you're honest.

[PRND21]

You can do it, I have confidence in you.

Cute. The fact remains that his "mental" claim will keep him from the Oval Office. Why are you pimping him?

[thoughtomator]

Anyone making the argument that pro-illegal stances get Hispanic votes is seriously mathematics challenged. Going from 30% of ~10 million voters to 40% of 20 million voters is a net loss. As long as the GOP gets less than 50% of the Hispanic vote - as is currently the case - bringing in more Hispanic voters makes it more difficult for the GOP to continue to win! That's not even counting the tsunami of conservatives ready to bail on what is now a socialist party.

[rock58seg]

See me in 2 1/2 years. If I am still alive we will compare notes.

Secure the Borders, build the fence, prosecute employers of illegals.

[hosepipe]

[ You can tell a faux Republican by the way they badmouth Tancredo, who is pretty much everything a real conservative could want in a Congressman. ]

Tancredo gives RINOs a bad name... he EXPOSES them..
As democrat enablers..

[thoughtomator]

Tancredo is among the most reliable conservative elected officials in the USA. What do you have differences with him on, other than immigration?

[PRND21]

Which branch of the military did you serve in?

If I said I didn't go because I was depressed as a kid would you vote for me for President?

[DManA]

How about a bill demanding the executive enforce the laws already on the books? Congress passes a law, executive ignores it - sounds like a Constitutional crisis to me.

[PRND21]

What do you have differences with him on, other than immigration?

Does he answer questions with questions like you? That would suck.

[thoughtomator]

Why don't you ask him and find out, my faux conservative friend?

[jmc813]

If I said I didn't go because I was depressed as a kid would you vote for me for President?

I figured you never served.

[PRND21]

Why don't you ask him and find out, my faux conservative friend?

You're not my friend and Tom is too busy dashing for cameras, microphones and Buchanan bred Tools.
But thanks for asking.

[PRND21]

I figured you never served.

I didn't, but not by going "Corporal Klinger".

[Beckwith]

The only thing that keeps me from identifying Senator Frist as the biggest loser in the Senate is the presence of John Kerry.

[HKMk23]

You're out of touch with the facts.

MOST -- over 70% and up to 80% in many polls on the subject -- believe that the Law needs to be adhered to FIRST and foremost. And, whether a particualr person is Mexican and a murderer or not is simply irrellevant. If they have entered this country by means other than allowed by our Laws, THAT must be corrected BEFORE we can legitimately begin to discuss anything else.

Look, I think your heart is in the right place; we've got to have human compassion for people who want to better themselves, but giving them a pass to break our Laws is not the way to do that. If we truly respect them as persons, we will respect them enough to hold them accountable to the Law. To do any less is an insult to their human dignity.

Something that has been completely lost in all of the clamor of this debate is just changing the immigration Law itself to make it easier to immigrate legally. The convoluted volumes of paperwork and the years it takes to work through the present LEGAL process of immigration are so prohibitive that they are causal in this whole situation. We have, in essence, a bereaucratic "Berlin Wall" that is so onerous that people lose heart; they give up hope. People think, "Screw it; I'll NEVER get through all of that." So, instead, they compromise their values -- those that actually have them -- and sneak across the border in the dark.

What is necessary, then, and what "Comprehensive Immigration Reform" must include, are two dominant elements:

1) Kill the paperwork demon that intimidates people into avoiding it by coming here illegally; "tear down this wall." One form, a background check and a health examination ought to be all that we need in order to determine, "Yes, you may come" or "No, we're sorry, you may not come." The process need not take ten years, it need not cost thousands of dollars, and it need not involve lawyers.

2) Rigid enforcement of immigration laws at the border and internally; with respect to both illegal entrants and employers of illegal entrants. We need to affirm that, having made the legal process simple, nobody's got any excuse for failure to comply.

THAT is TRUE, "Comprehensive" Immigration reform. THAT would be just and right. But we need to establish control of the border before we can even put that kind of reform on the table, and THAT is what the great majority of the American populace desires. Get control FIRST; stabilize the patient; stop the bleeding. THEN, we can implement somthing just, fair and rational.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

I don't like Pense's solution either

Pence's bill is almost the exact same one that Tancredo proposed a while back. Tancredo also included a guest-worker provision. You people are nuts if you think the Senate is going to support an enforcement-only bill. Pence's bill gives some wiggle room without compromising.

[kabar]

Pence's bill is almost the exact same one that Tancredo proposed a while back. Tancredo also included a guest-worker provision. You people are nuts if you think the Senate is going to support an enforcement-only bill. Pence's bill gives some wiggle room without compromising.

Pence's plan is amnesty. He wants to legalize the 12 to 20 million illegals already here. It is not a guest worker plan. It is amnesty.

I don't care what the Senate will support. The House will not support amnesty. This is what Tancredo said about Pence's plan:

"Mike Pence is making the same mistakes that the president has — using the straw man of mass deportations and redefining amnesty to suit his interests," Tancredo said. He added that he was baffled by Pence's shift from an enforcement-only position"

[Eroteme]

The House passed their border security bill first. It is the Senate that is being the obstacle by passing an amnesty bill which is a non-starter. We have two equal houses in our Congress. The Senate does not tell the House what to do. The House passed what the people widely support. The Senate passed crap. The Senate needs to cut the crap and seriously consider the House bill. Any bill which includes any form of amnesty is already a non-starter and the Senate knew that. The Senate is the obstacle.

Exactly! The senate refuses to even consider anything other than their own bill and just declare themselves The Reasonable Ones. The illogic is staggering. The capper to the laughable Orwellian campaign is that republicans will lose at the polls if the house refuses to fall in line and pass a Let's-Pretend-It's-Not-Amnesty Bill. No, if they lose, it's because it got passed.

[Spiff]

Exactly! The senate refuses to even consider anything other than their own bill and just declare themselves The Reasonable Ones. The illogic is staggering. The capper to the laughable Orwellian campaign is that republicans will lose at the polls if the house refuses to fall in line and pass a Let's-Pretend-It's-Not-Amnesty Bill. No, if they lose, it's because it got passed.

Check this out:

Vote breakdown by position for SB 2611:

YEAs ---62

Akaka (D-HI) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Baucus (D-MT)
Bayh (D-IN)
Bennett (R-UT)
Biden (D-DE)
Bingaman (D-NM) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Boxer (D-CA)
Brownback (R-KS)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Carper (D-DE)
Chafee (R-RI) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Clinton (D-NY) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Coleman (R-MN)
Collins (R-ME)
Conrad (D-ND) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Craig (R-ID)
Dayton (D-MN) - Up for Reelection in 2006
DeWine (R-OH) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Dodd (D-CT)
Domenici (R-NM)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feingold (D-WI)
Feinstein (D-CA) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Frist (R-TN) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Graham (R-SC)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hagel (R-NE)
Harkin (D-IA)
Inouye (D-HI)
Jeffords (I-VT) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Johnson (D-SD)
Kennedy (D-MA) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Kerry (D-MA)
Kohl (D-WI)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lautenberg (D-NJ)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Lieberman (D-CT)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Lugar (R-IN) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Martinez (R-FL)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Menendez (D-NJ)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Murray (D-WA)
Nelson (D-FL) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Obama (D-IL)
Pryor (D-AR)
Reed (D-RI)
Reid (D-NV)
Sarbanes (D-MD) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Schumer (D-NY)
Smith (R-OR)
Snowe (R-ME) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Specter (R-PA)
Stevens (R-AK)
Voinovich (R-OH)
Warner (R-VA)
Wyden (D-OR)

NAYs ---36

Alexander (R-TN)
Allard (R-CO)
Allen (R-VA) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Bond (R-MO)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burns (R-MT) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Burr (R-NC)
Byrd (D-WV) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Chambliss (R-GA)
Coburn (R-OK)
Cochran (R-MS)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Crapo (R-ID)
DeMint (R-SC)
Dole (R-NC)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Ensign (R-NV) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Enzi (R-WY)
Grassley (R-IA)
Hatch (R-UT) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Hutchison (R-TX) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Inhofe (R-OK)
Isakson (R-GA)
Kyl (R-AZ) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Lott (R-MS) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Nelson (D-NE) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Roberts (R-KS)
Santorum (R-PA) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Stabenow (D-MI) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Sununu (R-NH)
Talent (R-MO) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Thomas (R-WY) - Up for Reelection in 2006
Thune (R-SD)
Vitter (R-LA)

22 Republicans voted for SB 2611
4 (18%) of them are up for reelection in 2006.

39 Democrats voted for SB 2611
9 (23%) of them are up for reelection in 2006.

32 Republicans voted against SB 2611
10 (28%) of them are up for reelection in 2006.

4 Democrats voted against SB 2611
3 (75%) of them are up for reelection in 2006.

22% of those who voted for SB 2611 are up for reelection this year.

36% of those who voted against SB 2611 are up for reelection this year.

I see a pattern here.