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To: Dimensio
Are you attempting to make an argument? If so, I do not understand what point you are attempting to demonstrate.



Just pointing how few if any definitive statements
there are in this article. Evo articles are ALWAYS
full of if, could have, might have, may have,
might possibly be, etc etc etc.
One of the main reason I stay with
"Thus says The LORD"
101 posted on 03/30/2006 7:08:52 AM PST by WKB (Take care not to make intellect our god; Albert Einstein)
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To: WKB
Evo articles are ALWAYS full of if, could have, might have, may have, might possibly be, etc etc etc.

You actually bring up a good point. All cutting edge research in science, no matter what field they are in, contains such suppositions. This is the type of research that tends to make the news. Usually, when a press release is made, there are some solid facts about the subject while some further verification is necessary for many of the finer points. If it was all solidly known, it wouldn't be very cutting edge, would it?

By the time something makes it to the level of a good textbook on the subject (which can take years or even decades), though, there has been much more peer review of the subject, and much more verification & testing. This is not to say textbooks never make mistakes (even the best ones occasionally do), but that by the time the process has worked to this level, one can be assured that the central tenets of what one is reading are correct (in a reputable text, anyway).

Science always attempts to improve itself through time; theories that are broad in scope are almost never completely discarded (they don't need to be) - they are refined and brought into better focus. The basic core tenets of evolution, gradual change through time, have not changed since the time of Darwin. What we see now, though is positive identification and evidence that refine the detail of his theory in ways Darwin could never have dreamed.

It also is an (un?)fortunate fact, though, that science has become so complex that the finer details of the supporting evidence for theories take many, many hours of dedication and time to understand -- to those without the time and/or desire to do their homework on the subject, the results that science presents can indeed look like a potpourri of nonsense and proposition of faith, even though they aren't.

105 posted on 03/30/2006 8:05:17 AM PST by Quark2005 (Confidence follows from consilience.)
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To: WKB
Just pointing how few if any definitive
statements there are in this article.

What do you mean? The main phenomena being reported is asserted completely definitively. They say exactly what the phenomena is, when and where it occurs (in the lab, unobserved as yet in the cell but expected to occur there also) and the exact DNA sequence associated with the phenomena (not given in this popular article of course, but in the research paper).

They seem to state definitively everything that so warrants. What, specifically, do you think should have been stated definitively that wasn't? Or is your complaint entirely cynical and hypocritical (i.e. you would have made the accusation of dogmatic assertiveness with equal felicity if they did say more definitively)?

Evo articles are ALWAYS
full of if, could have, might have, may have,
might possibly be, etc etc etc.

Actually evolution is only mentioned one time in the article, in connection with the inference that this phenomena must not be deleterious, and is likely functional in some as yet unknown way, because otherwise evolution would have eliminated it.

So the one mention of evolution IS definite: evolution eliminates purely deleterious traits, so this one must be otherwise. Ironically it's all the questions about the design related functions of this phenomena (what precisely it does functionally, are there other phenomena of the same type, etc) that are -- however properly due to the need for further research -- couched in maybe's and possibly's.

One of the main reason I stay with
"Thus says The LORD"

No you don't. The LORD sayeth nothing whatever about computers and computer networks, for instance, but here you are.

107 posted on 03/30/2006 8:27:38 AM PST by Stultis (I don't worry about the war turning into "Vietnam" in Iraq; I worry about it doing so in Congress.)
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To: WKB
Just pointing how few if any definitive statements there are in this article. Evo articles are ALWAYS full of if, could have, might have, may have, might possibly be, etc etc etc.

You will find that scienctific writings are often filled with tentative language. This is because no field in science is considered conclusively proven. Evolution is no different than the rest of scientific study in this regard.

One of the main reason I stay with
"Thus says The LORD"


I do not understand how this is a logical alternative.
136 posted on 03/30/2006 12:22:14 PM PST by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: WKB; SampleMan
SampleMan said:
Apparently not all the scientists at Princeton are drinking the "everything there is to know about evolution is already known" Kool-Aid.

WKB said:
Evo articles are ALWAYS full of if, could have, might have, may have, might possibly be, etc etc etc.

For some reason we scientists either know EVERYTHING or know NOTHING. Make up your minds.

Part of good science is in defining not just what we know but also the boundaries on that knowledge. EVERY measurement made in a laboratory or in some kind of observation of the universe has some kind of error associated with it. You acknowledge that uncertainty and judge how accurate or precise your measurement happens to be (the two are not exactly the same) and therefor how much confidence you can have in your results. This is how science works.
138 posted on 03/30/2006 12:38:14 PM PST by gomaaa (We love Green Functions!!!!)
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