Posted on 03/29/2006 10:04:37 AM PST by kiriath_jearim
Should you be able to take your gun to work?
08:17 AM CST on Tuesday, March 28, 2006 By Vicente Arenas / KHOU
There's a battle looming over your right to take a gun to work. The controversy centers on whether you should be able to leave a firearm in your car.
If Granger Durdin could take her gun everywhere, she said she would.
"With the crime rates the way they are and with being a young female, I sometimes feel a little bit more vulnerable and with a gun I have the protection that I need to be safe," said Durdin.
The 29-year-old manager is not alone.
"It's very important. You don't know when someone is going to come after you," said gun owner Brenda Lorisch.
In Texas, businesses have the right to keep concealed weapons out of buildings. Now there's a move to allow companies to prohibit them from parking lots, too and that has some concealed carriers upset.
"I believe that's an infringement on civil liberties," said gun owner Pat Warren.
There are no real statistics that will tell you how many people take their guns to work and leave them in their cars. But when it comes to firearms, people in the gun industry will tell you that most people who have licenses to carry them won't leave home without them.
"It takes away our right to protect ourselves going to and from work," said Cheryl Lamar, Hot Wells Firing Range.
Houston-based ConocoPhillips is challenging a law in Oklahoma that allows workers to leave guns in their cars parked on company property.
The company said it is simply trying to provide a "safe and secure working environment for its employees by keeping guns out of their worksites, specifically refineries, natural gas plants and distribution terminals."
11 News found a sign outside an area plant prohibiting weapons, but saw no such signs in the company's parking lot. Still it's clear guns aren't welcome there.
When asked if she thought that this could lead to workplace violence, "Yes, I've heard that. I don't agree," said Sue King, NRA board member.
King grew up around guns. She said ConocoPhillips' efforts are a waste of time.
"If you think back to the incidents of workplace violence that we occasionally, rarely have in this country and keeping the Oklahoma legislation in mind, you'll realize that those people who commit workplace violence are either outright criminals, they're mentally unbalanced or they are true psychopaths," King said.
"I feel that it's a problem," said Tomasita Garza, Texans for Gun Safety.
This group disagrees with King, saying there are other problems with leaving a gun in a car.
"The reason being no vehicle is safe. No matter what kind of deterrents you use to keep your car from being stolen, it can still be stolen," said Garza.
ConocoPhillips is one of several companies asking an Oklahoma judge to clear the way for employers to prevent workers from keeping pistols in the parking lot.
The company says it, "supports the second amendment and the rights of law abiding citizens to own guns".
It's that amendment that granger Durdin says it gives her a little more confidence and the right to protect herself wherever she may be.
As an employer I stick with my post, and yes I believe the courts would laugh at any of my attempts to take control of my employees lives by taking control of the interiors of their automobiles. I believe that an employee of Wal Mart could win a case allowing her to keep her baby seat in the car while at work.
My sidearms go wherever I choose to take them.
The company said it is simply trying to provide a "safe and secure working environment for its employees by keeping guns out of their worksites, specifically refineries, natural gas plants and distribution terminals."
IF the company that prohibits you from carrying on its premises is also responsible to you for the criminal acts of others - since they are, after all, impliedly telling you that the place is safe and therefor you need no gun to protect yourself - then I'd have less of a problem.
I have a HUGE problem with them telling you that you can't have a gun in your car. What they are telling you is that you cannot take measures for your own security on your way to or from work, and this only months after Texas just passed a law enabling ANYONE who can legally possess a handgun to carry it concealed in their auto.
I also think that one must differentiate between business locations where there are only employees (back office operations, mines, refineries, etc.) vs. retail establishments. In my view, if a place is open to the public it should be illegal under the Constitution to deny someone the right to carry. Why? Well, if a place is open to the public you can't (and shouldn't be able to) say "No Blacks/Jews/Irish/Mexicans, etc. Allowed." That would be a violation of their civil rights...as would denying them the right to carry a firearm. And what applies to the public should also apply to the employees - they are, after all, also members of the public. With closed facilities, I'd only tolerate a gun ban if state/federal law specifically made the business financially responsible for any violence perpetrated on unarmed employees - and even then, I'd be very uneasy.
I carry at work whenever I want to - but, then again, I'm self-employed so I make that decision. I feel badly for those who don't have the freedom of choice that I do, particularly if they have to travel to and from bad neighborhoods to get to and from work.
It's already clear that I agree with you on that, right? Where we disagree is whether that would be just. Private property means nothing if anyone can force me to use my property in the way they wish me to.
And if they can't ensure the security of your car and its contents while in their lot, how can they ensure your safety while there unarmed?
Take them into my house, wouldja please? I've never practiced on live targets before.
Unless it's somewhere that doesn't allow them.
I agree 100 percent. We can't demand a company to allow us to bring guns to work.
Unless they are going to give employers the right to search your car, it's really a moot point. I'll keep whatever I want in my car, thank you.
Unless I choose to take one anyway or not go there, correct.
Well, many companies have a written policy that says they can search your car if it's in the lot and if you refise they can fire you. So there probably wouldn't be a problem unless they decided to do a search, which companies have done, but then you're screwed if you want to keep your job, unless the law protects you.
Where I work, you would have to choose to not go there, unless you didn't want to be going home that nite.
Sounds like Tyler Durdin of Fight Club.
That's your choice to go that direction, enjoy.
Shining example of personal integrity. You know? Integrity. Noun. What you do when nobody's looking.
Nonsense. Only the criminals are liable for their actions. What the employer is responsible for is taking reasonable actions to keep employees safe.
IF they prevent employees from protecting themselves then haven't they failed to take a reasonable action to protect their employees?
There are many things which you should be able to do, but can't, because you do not have the right to do them without someone else's willing participation.
This seems to fall into that category.
No, it's trying to enforce an employment contract which you presumably agreed to.
It also deprives me of my RKBA while not on company property during my commute.
No. You are free to park off the property, gun and all. Your RKBA is something the Government is not allowed to infringe upon. Whatever you contractually agree with another free citizen doesn't pertain. Just as your right to free speech and press does not allow you to violate non-disclosure contracts.
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