Posted on 01/22/2006 10:01:30 AM PST by Dark Skies
I think the logical end of Shi'a has taken suicide to the point of a good, even if it takes the entire planet with it, including all of their fellow Muslims. They, although not Shi'a, will, as Muslims, have to admire the Shi'a for all eternity in firdous, with all of the infidels as slaves of the true believers.
I hope we still have the time, the means, and the will to dispatch this "Mahdi" as our ancestors have done before. If not, it's possible we won't be anybody else's ancestors!
Its not the religion itself but the misinterpretation of ones own scriptures. The basic concept of a religion is based on truth and love. The political factions of Islam have misused thier religion and claim its about hate and killing getting islamic people to follow something opposing to god.
Islam is a bizarre syncretist cult. It was built of bits and pieces of the religions existing in the area at the time, but of course carefully structured to promote Mo and his descendants, who have been living well off it ever since. Mohammed was a pagan, many Arabs were Christians (although the Arian heresy had confused their Christianity and separated them from the Church in many areas), and there were also many Jews living there. Hence his "visions" conveniently combined the three.
Sometimes the bits and pieces don't fit together very well, but Islam is so anti-intellectual that few Muslims know and fewer care and the ones who do question it usually get killed.
Mohammed was basically a bandit chieftain. Islam is a religion designed for ruling a bunch of bandits.
Here is a an excerpt ....(from http://www.islam.tc/prophecies/jesus.html )
The Killing of Dajjal (anti-Christ) and the Victory of the Muslims
After the completion of Fajr Salaat (congregational dawn prayers), Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will open the door behind him where Dajjal accompanied by 70,000 Yahudis (Jews) will be. He will indicate with his hand to move away between him (Hadhrat Isa (A.S.)) and Dajjal. Dajjal will then see Hadhrat Isa (A.S.). At that time every Kafir on whom the breath of Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will reach, will die. His breath will reach up to the distance of his eyesight. The Muslims will then come down from the mountains and break loose on the army of Dajjal. There will be war, Dajjal will retreat, and Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will pursue Dajjal. Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will have two flexible swords and one shield with him and with these he will kill Dajjal at the Gate of Hudd. He willl show the Muslims the blood of Dajjal which will get on his shield. Eventually the Yahudis will be selected and killed. The swine will be killed and the cross broken. People will revert to Islam. Wars will end, and people will return to their respective countries. One Jamaat (group) of Muslims will remain in his service and companionship.
Hadhrat Isa (A.S.) will go to Fajr Rawha and perform Haj or Umrah (or both) from there. He will also go to the grave of Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam) and present his greetings and Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam) will reply. People will live comfortable lives. The wall of Yajooj and Majooj (Gog and Magog) will then break.
It is my understanding that the teachings on the Mahdi come from the Hadith, not the Koran.
I wasnt saying that these things actually happen, but was pointing out what I have been told and have read that many Muslims believe.
As far as the "unnecessary rhetoric" is concerned, I wanted my position clear that, as a Christian, I believe the Bible is the inspired word of God. Yes, written by men, but inspired by God.
Correct. 'Isa (the Muslims' version of Jesus) is just a prophet. People who believe in the Holy Trinity of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are believing the "opposite" of what 'Isa taught -- and are therefore "infidels."
The Hadith predict that when 'Isa returns, he will fight alongside the Mahdi, killing the Dajjal and all other infidels, helping the Mahdi establish a world-wide Islamic utopia.
The Hadith also say that 'Isa will destroy all the churches and break all the crosses ... and "kill all the swine."
See my FR homepage and the Links page for more information on Muslim End-Time beliefs.
I see what the swine comment was all about. But I still don't believe--at least, I've been told by Muslims I've spoken to--that the Christians and Jews are the targets of murder at the end of times...but that is more of a mainline, or PC opinion, from what I'm told, and what I've read from the Quran.
You're definately right about many of the pre-Islamic Arabs being Christian--many of whom were of cults like Arian that, when Islam rose, seemed to sort of just blend into Islam.
But the point about anti-intellectual is wrong in someways, because the Islam of today is not the Islam of the religion's "golden age." They seem to have gotten stuck on the "good old days" syndrome and many want the world to revert back to that stage. Islamic scholars are responsible for the number 0, as well as establishing the first hospitals for the mentally ill (in Baghdad of all places), and being far ahead (at the times of the Crusdades, at least) in understanding medicine...
There is an interesting story I read about, when during the Crusades a Christian doctor who had grew up in the Islamic society, tried to treat a Christian soldier wounded somewhat badly in the leg, and then a woman inflicted with "consumption." He cleaned and put anti-bacterial balm on the leg and simply recommended that the woman change her diet.
Then a doctor from France, who had traveled with the Crusaders, came in and told the soldier that he had to lose the leg or his life, and instruced his assistants to drill holes in the woman's head because she was over wrought by demons. Needless to say, both the patients died, and the Arab-raised Christian doctor swore off interacting with Crusaders.
I often wonder about people who have such a specific outline of the end of time. In fact they scare me...usually.
Yes evolution is a religion, the religion of the secularists and some trying to put a Christian dress upon it.
God said He formed flesh man out of the dust and He made them alive when HE breathed the breath of life = soul into his nostrils. What He did not tell us was when He made the souls.
Sorry for the delay. I've been busy at another thread and I invite you to read my posts there.
I readily admit that we're in the realm of interpretation of scripture here, and in Islam, as in any religion, you will be able to find a variety of interpretations. A more "mainstream" interpretation is that 'Isha will convert pious Christians from believers in the Trinity into believers in Allah, and will enforce Islamic dietary laws upon them by killing all the pigs so that these followers may no longer eat pork.
But there is also an interpretation involving the maskh (metamorphosis). Some hadith and commentators say that at the End Times infidel Christians, Jews, and faithless Muslims will be transformed into monkeys and swine. Sometimes this is taken literally, and sometimes taken metaphorically that "they are as bad / ignorant as monkeys and swine." Either way, when these are added to the 'Isha hadith, it can be read that 'Isha is killing the impious (nonconverting) Christians, Jews, and non-Muslims in general
I've been told by Muslims I've spoken to
I have never said that every Muslim believes the worst interpretations, such as I post at my FR homepage or on these threads. All I say is that some Muslims do -- and that there is a lot of propaganda out there about this. It's hard to say how many Muslims believe this "the West is Dajjalic and must be destroyed" mindset.
But I do say that many of the Muslims fighting us (and our Muslim allies) in the War on Terror believe these things, that apocalyptic beliefs are an important aspect of the Islamicist jihad, and that these things are not being reported by either the media or our government / military leaders -- probably because they are not being understood.
The End Times Hadith that kcmom and I have been citing are amongst those judged "authentic" by the majority of Muslims down through the centuries. They are not obscure or hard to find. Do a google search for mahdi / dajjal / qiyama and you'll find plenty of citations.
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