WorldWatch - Creation and Evolution in the Schools

World Watch and The Rhinoceros Times ^ | January 8, 2006 | Orson Scott Card

[Dimensio]

As what, an example of shoddy thinking trying to dishonestly pass itself off as valid science?

[Elsie]

"Darwinism", as generally used on these threads, is a pejorative.

Kinda like 'Fundamentalist', eh?

[jim_trent]

I did NOT demand that Creationism or ID be a "proven entity" before it is taught. Those are your words, not mine.

I have NEVER seen Creationism or ID try to prove anything. If you know of something where they did, let me know.

All I have ever seen them do is try to poke holes in Darwinism. There are lots of questions out there about Darwinism. However, just posing those questions does NOT prove Creationism or ID. That is all that I have ever seen Creationism or ID do.

[Elsie]

RATS!!

Let them stinkin' birds evolve like the rest of us!

[narby]

[Intelligent Design is just Creation Science in a new suit] Sorry, Orson, your friends got busted on this issue in the Dover case...

Is this how come they batch cut-and-pasted "Intelligent Design" on top of "Creationism" in the Pandas ID textbook?

[Elsie]

...stick with issues that can be argued from a strictly secular viewpoint such as the above. /I>

What!?

Play by THEIR rules??!?!?!

[mlc9852]

So you want Christians out of the conservative camp? Don't worry - a few more scandals and most of them will give up and stay home anyway.

[aNYCguy]

As a matter of fact, she's going on a school trip to a Creation conference tomorrow.

I hope she's not interested in pursuing a career in biology, cosmology, geology, anthropology, archaeology, or history. Sounds like she would have a lot of catching up to do if one of these fields strikes her interest.

[mlc9852]

It does seem to me that some atheists lack of sense of humor and take life way too seriously.

[nmh]

We just try to do our job.

Before you know it, she'll be all grown up. It goes soooo fast! I have to say, we have our setbacks with her but overall she's turning out well.

I love her school! The teachers, the Principals - just wonderful! Her friends are nice and reinforce what the school/church and parents teach - this makes our job easier. I thank God we can afford to do this. I know of many that want to and can't ... we really need vouchers ... so they aren't held hostage to a godless environment - public schools ... .

[narby]

So you want Christians out of the conservative camp?

Who said that?

Just like the intelligent Democrats don't want the lefties to go away, they just want them to moderate their extremism a bit.

There are perfectly good secular arguments for promoting strict constructionist judges, and for school choice, and against abortion (by giving constitutional rights to unborn babies). But creationism is a particular dogma of a minority of Christians, and should be kept out of partisan politics, because we will then lose. Not even religious jews would buy into creationism/ID. It is a wedge in the conservative camp, and it is only in the Democrats interest to promote it (which no doubt they are).

Do you understand my point and just disagree with me? Or is this just going in one ear and out the other?

[aNYCguy]

Proverbs 26:11
As a dog returns to its vomit, so a fool repeats his folly.

Proverbs 25:16
If you find honey, eat just enough— too much of it, and you will vomit.

Your turn.

[mlc9852]

I understand your point and disagree with you. Do you honestly believe anyone would base their vote for president on the ID/evolution debate? I know I wouldn't base my vote on one issue, especially that one. As I've said many times, teach evolution all day long and the majority of people will still believe God created humans.

[nmh]

She is VERY analytical. My spouse has his PHD in physics but wound up in technology. He finished with a 3.98 and felt that wasn't good enough for research - LOL!!! I didn't know him then ... anyway she appears to have his curiosity. His Dad was a doctor but she's not too empathetic ... perhaps it's her age ... I have little doubt that something in the hard sciences is where she'll wind up.

She does very well in school - a fast learner. I did okay but she is like my husband - just picks it up instantly. I often had to work at things. She's also very confident and outgoing. It will be interesting to see what she winds up studying later on and where she ends up working. Till then, we hope to continue her schooling at this particular Christian school.

[nmh]

"I believe both -- I believe I was created in God's image, out of material that was an ape."

LOL!

Guess we don't have the same God. You might want to lowercase your "god". Mine isn't an "ape" in any form.

[nmh]

Yes .... your point is?

God = Intelligent Design!

[Coyoteman]

"Darwinism", as generally used on these threads, is a pejorative.

Kinda like 'Fundamentalist', eh?

"Fundamentalist" is a legitimate word with defined meaning. "Fundy" on these threads would be a pejorative.

[Dimensio]

Actually, not all of them are strawman. Just from a glance, I can tell you right away that #7 is true -- finding holes in evolution (which ID-pushers have failed to do) would not amount to evidence for ID. Also #1 is true as well. The poster neglects to mention that the claim referenced by #1 is made with a sizeable amount of supporting evidence.

[nmh]

No, who we listen to clearly believe that God is the Intelligent Designer.

I don't know who you are referring to. If they wish to compromise, that's their business.

[Dimensio]

What do you expect from someone who has actually said "I am a creationist liar like all the rest."?