Replies

So when caught in a bare faced lie, you retreat and then attack a straw man argument?

What bare-faced lie? That Christians in the 18th Century believed in Biblical Creation?

And being a Christian and being a Creationist is hardly synonymous;

At the time of the Founding it most certainly was. For example, Webster's 1824 Dictionary defines CREATURE, n.

1. That which is created; every being besides the Creator, or every thing not self-existent. The sun, moon and stars; the earth, animals, plants, light, darkness, air, water, &c., are the creatures of God.

A current definition of Creationism:

cre·a·tion·ism
Belief in the literal interpretation of the account of the creation of the universe and of all living things related in the Bible.

Now, if you have evidence that the vast majority of founders who were Christians did not believe exactly this, then please adduce it, and explain the difference between their literal belief in Biblical Creation and a literal belief in Biblical Creation of any modern Creationist. Otherwise, I would appreciate it if you would kindly refrain from accusing me of bald-faced lies and logical fallacies.

I think it is an anachronistic interpretation to import the modern meaning of the term materialism as it is today back to Jefferson and Locke. If that makes me a liar in your mind, so be it.

Cordially,

What makes you a liar is the statement that "the Founding Fathers were Creationists"; this was a willful lie in that when I quoted Jefferson you responded "He is a DEIST". As if, by that, you meant that he didn't count. Deists don't believe in the Bible, so how could they be Biblical literalists in regard to Creation?

Your still beating a straw man. I stated that the majority of the founders were Christian, and the rest were most certainly influenced by Christian thought. You can let it go.

And it was Jefferson who referred to himself as a materialist. And I quoted it in the same sense that he meant it; someone who questioned supernatural accounts and equated Christian "miracles" with accounts of Greek "miracles" or Roman accounts of statues or beasts talking; i.e. he gave to them no credence.

Now if you want to say that someone who denies the supernatural, claims to be a materialist, and one that you refer to as a Deist; is a Creationist - than you have stretched the meaning of the word to embrace anyone who believes that the universe was created by any agency (including ID advocates)as Creationists. As such the word looses almost all meaning as according to this definition only atheists would not be Creationists.

Now, if you have evidence that the vast majority of founders who were Christians did not believe exactly this, then please adduce it

Wow, shifting the burden of proof, I see. You asserted that the vast majority of the founding fathers were creationists, so it's your burden to provide evidence for it.