Iraq draft says laws must conform to Islam -text

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[Charlesj]

Iraq draft says laws must conform to Islam -text

BAGHDAD, Aug 22 (Reuters) - A draft constitution for Iraq to be presented to parliament on Monday will make Islam "a main source" for legislation and ban laws that contradict religious teachings, members of the parliamentary drafting panel said.

[bnelson44]

anyone have a link to the text of the constitution in English?

[Warren_Piece]

Just a small point of correction - the constitution has to pass in 15 of the 18 provinces. Also, it's confusing, but if I read the TAL right, if 3 provinces defeat it by 2/3 , then they have to start all over again. These are actually some really good safeguards.

Mark my words, though. If this goes down, it'll be over the oil money, not religion.

[commonerX]

""Seriously. Why is anyone surprised? """
I'm not. That's one reason why I opposed this invasion -- and sending American troops to die in Iraq -- from the beginning. The country was a 4th rate military power, didn't have WMDs, wasn't being 9-11, and couldn't be "changed" into a democracy. A lot of blood spilled in behalf of utopian fantasies by policy gurus who almost uniformly don't have any kids or kin in the military.""


Not me.

I have said these same things before the invasion of Iraq.
But to many if you say this you don't support the troops and are a terriorist support by defualt. Or you hate Bush or maybe you'd be more comfortable at DU.

[bnelson44]

"that is true, women's rights are the key to stopping islamofacism. any "givebacks" in this new constitution in that area, and its over."

Women's rights do not conflict with Islam. I don't see a problem here if Islamic Law is a main source for the Laws of Iraq and so are Democratic principles.

[Warren_Piece]

Not released yet. BTW, here's the lastest update from Omar at ITM:

Update (10:45 pm local time):

Chairman of the National Assembly Hachim Al-Hasani announced that discussions are still underway among all involved parties in hope for reaching "accord" before disclosing the draft; this is expected to be done within an hour and then the Assembly shall start a session to approve the draft immediately after that. This is of course in effort to convince the Sunnis to be part of the process, however if this last discussion fails the Sheat and Kurdish blocks are most likely to present the draft without the "OK" from the Sunni politicians.

Meanwhile there have been rallies of joy and celebrations in many Iraqi cities mainly in the south and people went to the streets in thousands although it's past 10 pm now.

The Iraqi TV has been playing patriotic songs all the evening and in between the incoming reports and updates; one song named "Good bye sadness" was played more than 20 times so far!!

[TheDon]

Agreed. I think the Iraqis realize that better than we do.

[rightwingintelligentsia]

You're right; nobody should panic until this thing plays out. Two other points to consider.

The Afghan constitution seems to me to be very similar in the sense that Islam is closely intertwined with "democracy." According to Madhavi Sundler, a commentator on FindLaw: Afghanistan's new Constitution is unabashedly Islamic. The first Article declares Afghanistan an "Islamic Republic." Islam is declared to be the official religion of the state. And the Constitution expressly bars any law "contrary to the beliefs and provisions of the sacred religion of Islam." I didn't see the same level of concern when that document was approved.

Second, a secular Middle Eastern government isn't necessarily one that is democratic or friendly to the U.S. Iraq under Saddam is a case in point, as is present-day Syria.

[federal]

Just a small point of correction

Thanks for the correction, I was sort of guessing because it had been a long time since I had read about the ratification process, but I knew it was a strong one which was going to give all the minorities a say in the final wording.

My feelings have always been that the fight was going to be over the money, And the fact that representative governments are always messy at the start.

The important think is a strong legitimate means for people to file grievances and make settlements because there are going to be plenty

[Warren_Piece]

Small update at ITM:

Update (11:20 pm local time):

The Assembly has assembled! Voting will follow so stay tuned!

[PigRigger]

"Regarding Islam and the constitution: it was agreed upon that no laws that are against the widely agreed upon values of Islam can be issued and no laws that are against the values of democracy and human rights can be issued....."

Hmmmmm, me starts to wonder how anything will ever get agreed upon.....

[Warren_Piece]

They'll probably have more lawyers than the USA . Hey, maybe we can ship a few over there to help them sort this Islam vs human rights thing out. I'm sure we won't miss them.

[Modernman]

You're right; nobody should panic until this thing plays out.

People should also realize that much of the bluster we're seeing come out of this process is good old-fashioned Middle-Eastern souk negotiating.

As anyone who has ever purchased a Persian rug knows, Middle-Easterners approach negotiations quite differently from people in the West.

The end result here will probably be something everyone in Iraq can live with, though nobody will be thrilled.

[Warren_Piece]

Hey, Pigrigger, don't forget, we're still sorting this one out:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof

[Warren_Piece]

From ITM:

Update (11:30 pm local time): PM Dr. Jafari and president Talbani join the session and the Assembly members are receiving their copies of the draft.

[PigRigger]

"And if we try to dictate the new constitution and its terms to the Iraqi people, they will simply end up rejecting or ignoring it....."

The result of this experiment in freedom will only be known years, maybe decades, down the road......If it succeeds, that is an Islamic state willing to live in the civilized world where differences are settled politically, than the sacrifice endured by our country will have been well worth the heavy price.

In the end, millions of lives may be saved.

If I am wrong; the war we hope to avoid, will have to be fought regardless.....with many more at risk...

[OXENinFLA]

Al-Saghir said the blocs agreed that no laws would be adopted that contradict the principles of Islam. "In addition, no law shall be adopted that contradicts human rights and democratic principles," he said.

I'm confused. Islam DOES "contradict human rights and democratic principles"

LINK

[Warren_Piece]

Sorry, it would appear I'm turning this into a live thread. If updates should be posted elsewhere, let me know.

[Happy2BMe]

Did any of this come as a surprise?

[bnelson44]

"I'm confused. Islam DOES "contradict human rights and democratic principles"

No! Only if interpreted to do that. Like Christianity, you can interpret it any way wish. Hopefully, Iraq will be a model.