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Stray Dog in Kenya Saves Abandoned Baby
Yahoo News ^ | 5/9/5 | Varmint Al

Posted on 05/09/2005 8:38:15 AM PDT by Varmint Al

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To: Monterrosa-24
Minks kill for fun!

Yes, and often it is rats, such as in abondoned grain bins. I had never seen rats run screaming down the road until I saw 2 minks invade their bin and start the killing.

41 posted on 05/09/2005 10:05:56 AM PDT by MJemison
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To: monday
Except for cats, and some dogs, and Orcas, and some Raptors. Are you sure you want to stick with that claim? There are instances of many animals killing for reasons other than hunger. Many just for fun.

Yes, I believe I will. Man will kill his own species for no reason other then he just wants to do it and it gives a measure of satisfaction. This takes a cognitive thought process. Animals, cats for instance will hunt birds, mice chipmunks etc because they are hunters by nature and if they do not consume them for food they may bring them home as an "offering" to the leader of the pack (it's owner). Cats will fight and maybe kill other cats because they are defending their territory. Dogs may attack other animals if their territory is violated, they feel threatened or they are protecting their master or they are frightened. AS for Raptors and Orca's you will have to link me to someplace that has info regarding them killing, for sport, their own species or other species for that matter.

42 posted on 05/09/2005 10:19:53 AM PDT by JoeV1 (Democrat Party-The unlawful and corrupt leading the blind and uneducated)
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To: JoeV1
"Man will kill his own species for no reason other then he just wants to do it and it gives a measure of satisfaction."

So do grizzlies, who often kill cubs, and sometimes females, and chimps and lions and hyenas... etc. etc. You should watch Animal Planet more often. Murder isn't a human only behavior. Cats keep their prey alive simply to toy with them.
43 posted on 05/09/2005 10:40:33 AM PDT by monday
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To: JoeV1
No other species of animal kills strictly for the joy of killing.

Because no other species of animal can experience joy.

Unlike other animals, we have free will, and can choose to do evil.

It's also doubtful that the mother who abandoned the child did it for "the joy of killing."

44 posted on 05/09/2005 10:48:09 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: Varmint Al
The seven-pound infant wasn't even bruised when the stray dog carried her across a busy road and a barbed wire fence.

The unnamed dog lives in a compound bordering the Ngong Forests in Nairobi.

11-year-old Felix Omondi is one of several children who also live in the compound.

The nursing dog was foraging for food for her puppies when it found the baby girl.

45 posted on 05/09/2005 10:54:40 AM PDT by freepatriot32 (If you want to change government support the libertarian party www.lp.org)
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To: HairOfTheDog

doggie ping


46 posted on 05/09/2005 10:55:21 AM PDT by freepatriot32 (If you want to change government support the libertarian party www.lp.org)
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To: monday
So do grizzlies, who often kill cubs, and sometimes females, and chimps and lions and hyenas... etc. etc. You should watch Animal Planet more often. Murder isn't a human only behavior. Cats keep their prey alive simply to toy with them.

What you are saying refers to the term anthropomorphism, the attributing of human characteristics to animals. It doesn't really make sense to do this because we cannot get into the minds of these creatures. For the taking of a life to be deemed murder there must be premeditation. Perhaps I should have clarified my original statement to use this term instead of the term "kill"

Since their (animals) primary motivating force is instinct, it is probably safe to say they are driven to acts of violence by reasons other then sheer pleasure. I don't believe there is an element of premeditation in what they do

47 posted on 05/09/2005 11:00:14 AM PDT by JoeV1 (Democrat Party-The unlawful and corrupt leading the blind and uneducated)
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To: JoeV1
"I don't believe there is an element of premeditation in what they do"

You would be wrong. Animals kill for many of the same reasons humans do, jealousy, for sport, establishing dominance, for sexual favors, for food, even just bullying, killing off the weak or inept. Humans have expanded on the number of reasons to kill but we are not different from animals except in our increased sophistication.
48 posted on 05/09/2005 11:29:36 AM PDT by monday
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To: Aquinasfan
"Because no other species of animal can experience joy."

Thats absurd. You have never seen puppies or otters playing or colts frolicking on a sunny day? Animals have limited reasoning abilities and absolutely no abstract thought processing ability, but that doesn't mean they can't experience joy.
49 posted on 05/09/2005 11:35:46 AM PDT by monday
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To: monday
"I don't believe there is an element of premeditation in what they do"

You would be wrong. Animals kill for many of the same reasons humans do, jealousy, for sport, establishing dominance, for sexual favors, for food, even just bullying, killing off the weak or inept. Humans have expanded on the number of reasons to kill but we are not different from animals except in our increased sophistication.

You are missing the point. I said animals don't kill, as man does in many cases, strictly for the pleasure of killing. I never said they only killed for food as you seem to believe. Sure they kill for dominence and to dispose of the weak and lame. Killing the weak and lame is natures way of cleansing the gene pool. In any case these actions are instinctual, not premeditated.

50 posted on 05/09/2005 11:40:05 AM PDT by JoeV1 (Democrat Party-The unlawful and corrupt leading the blind and uneducated)
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To: monday
"Because no other species of animal can experience joy."

Thats absurd. You have never seen puppies or otters playing or colts frolicking on a sunny day?

Animals operate on instinct. They don't have will. Animal play is part of their instinctive behavior, and a sign of animal health or "contentment."

This differs radically from human joy:

joy ( P ) Pronunciation Key (joi) n.

1) Intense and especially ecstatic or exultant happiness. The expression or manifestation of such feeling.
2)A source or an object of pleasure or satisfaction: their only child, their pride and joy.

I think we tend to anthropomorphize animals. I know, I used to have a couple of dogs.

51 posted on 05/09/2005 11:48:43 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: monday
Found this, FYI:
St. Thomas nowhere treats in detail of animal instinct, but his position on the subject is rendered none the less clear from a great many passages in the "Summa Theologica". He is in full agreement with the best modern authorities in laying chief emphasis on the absence of consciousness of the end as the essential characteristic of instinct. He says (op. cit., I-II, Q. xi, a. 2, C.): "Although beings devoid of consciousness (coqnitio) attain their end, nevertheless they do not attain a fruition of their end, as beings do who are endowed with consciousness. Consciousness of one's end, however, is of two kinds, perfect and imperfect. Perfect consciousness is that by which one is conscious not only of the end, and that it is good, but also of the general nature of purpose and goodness. This kind of consciousness is peculiar to rational natures. Imperfect consciousness is that by which a being knows the purpose and goodness in particular, and this kind of consciousness is found in brute animals, which are not governed by free will but are moved by natural instinct towards those things which they apprehend. Thus the rational creature attains complete enjoyment (fruitio); the brute attains imperfect enjoyment, and other creatures do not attain enjoyment at all."

52 posted on 05/09/2005 12:01:56 PM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: zlala

"...the root cause of the problem."

Excellent! Someone who understands root cause analysis.


53 posted on 05/09/2005 12:26:58 PM PDT by beelzepug (Parking For Witches Only--All Others Will Be Toad.)
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To: Aquinasfan
"Animal play is part of their instinctive behavior, and a sign of animal health or "contentment."

It's the same with human children, or are you going to try to tell me that running, screaming, kids are deep in thoughtful contemplation of the joys of being 5 years old?

If I look back on my life, my highest highs and lowest lows were when I was young, before I learned reason and self restraint. I am not buying that it takes some higher intellect to experience intense joy.
54 posted on 05/09/2005 12:42:25 PM PDT by monday
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To: Teflonic
Cats may be willing to do the same but they just can't lift the babies...

Cats suck the breath out of babies!

JUST KIDDING!

55 posted on 05/09/2005 2:53:54 PM PDT by Mark was here (My tag line was about to be censored.)
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To: JoeV1
Actually that is not true. Studies have shown dogs kill for the fun as well!
56 posted on 05/09/2005 3:04:54 PM PDT by ihv2bme
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To: Teacher317

Mama Dog didn't kill it before bringing it to be with the puppies, so I would not expect that she regarded it as food.


57 posted on 05/09/2005 3:10:11 PM PDT by The Red Zone (Florida, the sun-shame state and Georgia, the rotten peach, and Illinois the chicken injun.)
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To: Aquinasfan
Because no other species of animal can experience joy.

Tell that to my cats.

58 posted on 05/09/2005 3:11:35 PM PDT by The Red Zone (Florida, the sun-shame state and Georgia, the rotten peach, and Illinois the chicken injun.)
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To: The Red Zone
Tell that to my cats.

I would never argue with a cat.

59 posted on 05/10/2005 4:54:11 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: monday
It's the same with human children, or are you going to try to tell me that running, screaming, kids are deep in thoughtful contemplation of the joys of being 5 years old?

No, but I wouldn't compare them to animals either.

60 posted on 05/10/2005 5:09:48 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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