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To: tomahawk
Again, though, I don't believe anyone is saying that this equates to what the Nazis did, merely that the reasoning is similar. The "they're better off dead", "they shouldn't live" argument.

Unfortunately, they are linking this with Nazism, and the reasoning is not similar in the slightest.

Also, although there was a legal process in this case, it was completely shoddy in that the judge clearly is not interested in her actual condition, in that he disregards competent medical opinion to the contrary without having her re-tested.

While I have serious doubts, obviously the judges did not. There was also substantial medical opinion to the effect that Schiavo was in a PVS, and that much of the brain was no longer present. But, to me the only issue is the weight of evidence supporting Terri's desires. On this, the judge accepted the statements of, I believe, 5 witnesses. Perhaps he should have considered more. But in any case, this hardly equates to comparisons with the Third Reich.

50 posted on 03/26/2005 11:35:48 AM PST by MACVSOG68
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To: MACVSOG68
On this, the judge accepted the statements of, I believe, 5 witnesses. Perhaps he should have considered more. But in any case, this hardly equates to comparisons with the Third Reich.

Sounds like ancient Roman law. Find some "witnesses", admit hearsay as evidence, speedy trial and then execution.
51 posted on 03/26/2005 11:43:50 AM PST by MTOrlando
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To: MACVSOG68
On this, the judge accepted the statements of, I believe, 5 witnesses. Perhaps he should have considered more. But in any case, this hardly equates to comparisons with the Third Reich.

A diagnosis of PVS means a doctor did not find any sign of cognition. Three doctors, hired by Michael, didn't find any because they didn't look very hard (looking seriously for signs of congition requires more than an hour exam, but none of Michael's "doctors" spent even that long). Two doctors hired by the Schindlers spent longer describing Terri, and were able to describe specific signs of cognition that they found.

The notion that 'majority rules' diagnosis makes any sense under such circumstances is absurd. It would be analagous to a drug smuggler arguing that since three of the cops searching his property didn't find any drugs, and only two of them found drugs, there weren't really any drugs.

54 posted on 03/26/2005 11:55:29 AM PST by supercat ("Though her life has been sold for corrupt men's gold, she refuses to give up the ghost.")
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To: MACVSOG68
I don't think these people are intimating that America is Nazi Germany. I think there are a few stiking similarities between the justifications the left has put forward for murdering Shiavo and the justifications the Nazi regime put forward to the public to support mercy killings. As long as an intelligent analysis is made, I don't see anything wrong with using one of the most notable examples in recent history of a government gone awry as a litmus test to see if our own government is overstepping. This comparison needs to be made to see where the slipperly slope leads.

P.S. The Jesus comparison is a bit freaky though.

57 posted on 03/26/2005 12:02:40 PM PST by Texas Federalist (If you get in bed with the government, you'll get more than a good night's sleep." R. Reagan)
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To: MACVSOG68

I believe there were 3 "witnesses" in total, M. Schiavo and two of his blood relatives.


58 posted on 03/26/2005 12:03:12 PM PST by tomahawk (If we can't stand for life, what can we stand for?)
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To: MACVSOG68

hitler started the euthanasia movement. It's legitimizing itself here, now.


61 posted on 03/26/2005 12:10:52 PM PST by monkeywrench
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To: MACVSOG68
Unfortunately, they are linking this with Nazism, and the reasoning is not similar in the slightest.

The reasoning is exactly the same. There is not one slightest difference. Both are occasions where the killing was considered a mercy killing.

Useless Eaters, an award-winning presentation in which the comparisons are shown.

I have worked as a medical professional for over 25 years and watched as the culture changed from one of support for the disabled to one of victimization.

The German euthanasia of the disabled came about through a collusion between the medical establishment and the courts, which is exactly what we are seeing today.

The Germans used film to change the cultural viewpoint into one that accepted that some lives were not worth living. Today we have two films winning numerous awards and both are about disabled people seeking death - The Sea Inside and Million Dollar Baby. In both of these films, life as a disabled person is sold as agonizing and miserable. Death is a release from misery.
Studies have shown repeatedly that most people in the circumstances of those in the film do not rate their quality of life as lower than the the rest of us, however.

Finally, a utilitarian society is already here, for the most part. Just as in Germany, the costs of caring for those who were/are disabled is being discussed in the medical journals. The disabled are being viewed as potential organ suppliers - some are putting forth the idea that chronically ill and brain damaged children should be used for harvesting of organs - before they die, to boot.

The definition of death itself is being changed, for the first time since 1967. Suggestions have been made that the brain damaged should be used for medical experiments.

To read the medical journals today is a chilling experience. Wesley Smith explained in one of his books how the cultural debate on change would move from the professional journals to the public. Years ago I used to post about what was taking place in expensive publications, and there was only a small response here. What you are seeing now on FR is the occasion of the public realizing where we are headed.

If you want more evidence, please ask.

97 posted on 03/27/2005 10:10:57 AM PST by MarMema ("America may have won the battles, but the Nazis won the war." Virginia Delegate Bob Marshall)
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