Posted on 03/15/2005 7:20:27 AM PST by PatrickHenry
I decided to see if "Meteor orbits and dust", NASA SP-135 was available online on the NASA technical report server. Sadly, it is not available digitally (yet). Here is the reference the server has for it, though:
Meteor orbits and dust
Hawkins, G. S.
NASA Center for AeroSpace Information (CASI)
NASA-SP-135 , 19670101; Jan 1, 1967
Concentrations and orbital calculations of meteors and meteoritic and extraterrestrial dust particles - conference
Accession ID: 67N32038
Document ID: 19670022709
No Digital Version Available - Order This Document from CASI
Updated/Added to NTRS: 2004-11-03
---
Note the numerous references to "1967."
A brief Google search for the same docuemtn, however, finds this:
http://www.creationism.org/ackerman/AckermanYoungWorldChap16.htm
"IT'S A YOUNG WORLD AFTER ALL"
Bibliography
Hawkings, G. S. (ed.). Meteor Orbits and Dust, Smithsonian Contributions Astrophysics, vol. 2 (Washington, D.C: Smithsonian Institution and NASA, 1976).
Note two important things:
1: The date is wrong (the 67 is transposed to 76 - possibly accidental)
2: The editors name is mis-spelled.
The book this bibliography is for bases its first chapter on the fraudulent mis-interpretation of the lunar dust data.
More information on the Creationist moon-dust scam is here:
http://www.don-lindsay-archive.org/creation/moondust.html
"Richard Bliss of the ICR has since produced another number, a million tons, this time giving a reference to "COMITE Speciale De I'annee Geophysique International, Moscow, August 1985". That sounds pretty recent, until you realize that the International Geophysical Year was held in 1957-1958. The committee report was published in 1958, not 1985."
Interesting that *again* the Creationist in question transposes the publication date. One could perhaps assume accident, except that in both cases, the transposition *conveniently* makes the date much more recent.
With such willingness on the part of many Creationist authors to fabricate data, and such a willingness by Creationism believers to believe such incorrect data without serious investigation (or even *basic* investigation... took about 45 seconds on Google to figure out not only that the moon dust arguement was a lie, but where, how and when it started).... why should anyone honestly and seriously take the Creationist viewpoint seriously?
A scientist who fabricated fraudulent lines of arguement like these, or one who diligently supported such arguements, would be laughed out of the profession as soon as found out. But Creationists still take Gish seriously. It boggles the mind.
Now.....complete.....your..... thought..... by.... telling us "all together now" what....it....really....is. Is it a bird ? Is it plane ? No, it is a........ and thanks for telling us what it is....
I've only been here a shade longer than you, and I am already well aware of the running gag that the MSM (that's Main Stream Media for you, clearsight) calls FR a "blog", and that FReepers (that's what we call people who post on Free Republic, clearsight) are constantly correcting them by saying, "It's not a blog: it's a discussion forum!"
So for you, clearsight, you're welcome.
DITTO!
After this length of time using the same arguement... yes, I do. Had it been an honest mistake, those who made the mistake and promulgated it would have made retractions.
Givign them the most charity I can leads me to believe that even at their most honest, they weren't that honest. The initial claims of thousands of feet of dust were based on faulty math... and apparetnlyfautly math based on very *simple* math. The sort of error that can easily be made.... but will be easily caught when you check your work. Sinc ethat error was not corrected, it is reasonable to conclude:
1: The math was done once, and was not checked because it supported an existing bias. This is scientifically dishonest.
or...
2: The math was checked and found to be flawed, but the original flawed answer was used because it was preferable. This is also flawed.
This is just one instance. However, the world of YEC is *full* of such things. The YE concept is based on a foundation of falsehoods. It strains credulity to believe that people so clearly intelligent (as shown by how successful many are are making money from this) would be so consistently stupid. Dishonesty is a far simpler and more likely answer.
UPDATE 2002 - Added for the Web Version A recent review of the latest and best evidence by creation scientists Andrew A. Snelling and David E. Rush indicates that there is much less dust in the earth-moon vicinity that earlier estimated. As a result most creationists now believe that the moon-dust argument should not be used. For more information on the latest data check the link: . This author agrees with the position of Answers in Genesis and does not currently use the moon-dust argument. However we need to remember that the evolutionist conception of the solar system's origin assumes much more dust in the past than is currently present. Finally, there are many factors known to remove cosmic dust as time passes (see chapter 3).
That's a non-retraction retraction ("Well, we were wrong... but the evolutionsts view is wrong, so we were right anyway.")
And it only took them *how* many years to post that *waaaay* down at the bottom? While leaving the lies and falsehoods and BS for all the world to skim over and get the wrong ideas about up top?
If you write a chapter of a book based on an entirely wrong premise, if you find out it's just dead wrong, you don't come out with a new edition that reapeats it all but puts a tiny disclaimer on it. If you are honest, you remove or replace that chapter entirely, preferably with a disclaimer at the end of the new chapter saying "anybody with a first edition... I'm sorry, but I was wrong."
Out of sheer politeness, they should have nailed the disclaimer to the *top*.
Oh, and a little mental exercise for you: read through the disclaimer your excerpted, and see if you can find the massive logic flaw with it. There is an internal inconsistancy that's just damend funny.
Please FREEPMAIL me if you want on, off, or alter the "Gods, Graves, Glyphs" PING list --
Archaeology/Anthropology/Ancient Cultures/Artifacts/Antiquities, etc.
The GGG Digest -- Gods, Graves, Glyphs (alpha order)
Ok, that was one of the funnier pings.
I'll read it :p
Thanks, it's great to be appreciated in my own time (y'know, before I go too far and get banned ;').
My consensus has always been that to GOD a minute could be a million years to us earth bound Bible reading bumpkins. (grin) The six days it took him to create the heavens and the earth would then translate into a slightly longer period of time than 6,000 years.
I frequently got into trouble while in school because I never could swallow that 6,000 year time line.
According to all the email questionnaires I have taken I can qualify to be older than dirt so I can make these assumptions.
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Gods |
Just updating the GGG info, not sending a general distribution.To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list.The Neandertal EnigmaFrayer's own reading of the record reveals a number of overlooked traits that clearly and specifically link the Neandertals to the Cro-Magnons. One such trait is the shape of the opening of the nerve canal in the lower jaw, a spot where dentists often give a pain-blocking injection. In many Neandertal, the upper portion of the opening is covered by a broad bony ridge, a curious feature also carried by a significant number of Cro-Magnons. But none of the alleged 'ancestors of us all' fossils from Africa have it, and it is extremely rare in modern people outside Europe." [pp 126-127] |
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