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To: shubi
Stop trying to conflate bronze age superstition with the Gospel.

Before I can honor your request, you'll have to tell me what you believe “the Gospel” is and how you know what it is. You've already stated that it is possible that Christ was mistakenly quoted in the Bible (“Another explanation is that someone else said this and it was attributed to Christ.”) and that the Genesis account of the Flood is “nonsense”. What else in Scripture do you consider to be nonsense? What is your basis for rejecting the Old Testament testimony concerning the physical reality of the Flood, and for rejecting the New Testament testimony concerning the physical reality of the Flood (including your tentative rejection of the words of Christ), but accepting the Old and New Testament testimony concerning the physical reality of the resurrection of Christ?

For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.

Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.

And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.

And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.


1,056 posted on 02/09/2005 10:58:17 AM PST by Tares
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To: Tares
What is your basis for rejecting the Old Testament testimony concerning the physical reality of the Flood, and for rejecting the New Testament testimony concerning the physical reality of the Flood

The Chinese writings that were done at the time of the flood.

1,059 posted on 02/09/2005 11:00:05 AM PST by WildTurkey (When will CBS Retract and Apologize?)
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To: Tares
...What else in Scripture do you consider to be nonsense? What is your basis for rejecting the Old Testament testimony concerning the physical reality of the Flood...

Not directed to me, but here gos...

Anything said in the Bible that contradicts the best scientific reasoning must be considered a miracle, and believed or not believed on faith. There are miracles recorded in the Bible that have left no physical imprint on the earth, and the Flood is one of these. Belief in the Flood as a miracle makes sense as an article of faith, but it is nonsense to assert that it has left a physical record.

1,064 posted on 02/09/2005 11:25:45 AM PST by js1138
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To: Tares

Talk origins has some nice papers on why the Noah story and other literalist crapola are silly. Go here:

www.talkorigins.org/index.html

Here is an excerpt from one of my sermons on the Gospel:
(I don't normally do this online, so you are very blessed)

The Rev. Billy Graham tells of a time early in his career when he arrived in a small town to preach a sermon. Wanting to mail a letter, he asked a young boy where the post office was. When the boy had told him, Dr. Graham thanked him and said, “If you’ll come to the Baptist church this evening, you can hear me telling everyone how to get to heaven.”


“ I don’t think I’ll be there.” The boy said, “ You don’t even know your way to the post office.”

[Big SNIP!!!]


Jesus Sent to Us! Jesus Crucified for Us! Jesus Died for us! Jesus Resurrected!-this is the GOOD NEWS!


For God sent his Son, who has always existed, to us to show us His sacrifice on the Cross. This act expunges our sins so that God can look at us as pure and holy, although we can never deserve this consideration. This is called God’s Grace, the unmerited favor.

We cannot earn this, but we are imputed with sinlessness or righteousness because of Jesus dying on the Cross. But this is still not enough to get us into Heaven. This may only be enough to get us to the Post Office. Jesus had to conquer death in His resurrection after 3 days in the tomb and ascend to Heaven. Then he came back and appeared to the apostles and disciples and many others so that they could believe in these events. It is only in the belief that Jesus is God’s Son, that he died, that he resurrected and that the testimony of those that saw Him alive after His death reinforces our belief that we can find Heaven. God gives us the directions to Heaven by his gift to us of these events. Then he leads us to Heaven by the gift of the Holy Spirit- all this is God’s Grace.

Now is there anything you want to know about evolution, or do you still insist on questioning my Christianity?


1,067 posted on 02/09/2005 11:48:00 AM PST by shubi (Peace through superior firepower.)
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To: Tares; shubi
You've already stated that it is possible that Christ was mistakenly quoted in the Bible (“Another explanation is that someone else said this and it was attributed to Christ.”) and that the Genesis account of the Flood is “nonsense”.

Yup, if we don't have the Bible to go by, we have nothing. What then would be the basis for shubi's ministry?

1,135 posted on 02/09/2005 2:36:47 PM PST by houeto ("Mr. President , close our borders now!")
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