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To: HolgerDansk
Believe what you like. There is no way on Earth that an Amtrak train covering the upper Plains states--territory Greyhound doesn't even want to cover any more, it's so sparse--is SUBSIDIZING the capital needs of the northeast corridor. Surely Amtrak isn't covering the capital needs either, but those trains running through the west aren't making money for anyone but the lucky saps who get to ride them.

When I referred to the welfare sinkholes in North Dakota and Montana, I was thinking more along the lines of agricultural subsidies in addition to other services that are naturally more expensive in sparse rural areas and not provided by the market. Defense doesn't begin to explain the federal money piled high in those states like snow drifts in February.

If Massachusetts has more millionaires, that's because we have people who work hard, succeed, and earn the fruits of their labor. I don't cotton well to class-warfare arguments that the larger number of high-income people in northeast states mean that we should be sending so much more to farmers and rural folk as Congress has been doing for years. It could just as easily mean that we need some CONSERVATIVE government that allows us to keep some of our money--turn Amtrak over to the states or a private company, and see which train lines are still running in 5 years. I bet it won't be the one running through Havre, MT.

To replace the one train per day, the federal government would have to either 1) build a string of Class 1 airports along the northern tier, or 2) bring US 2 up to Interstate standards, both of which would cost billions and certainly not break even.

Excuse me, but since when is every two-bit town entitled to a Class 1 Airport or an interstate-quality road? If Montana wants to make US 2 into an interstate, it has the road taxes to do so. That they haven't yet shows how little sense it makes to have transportation to the northern prairies be a federal entitlement. I can see more people out my front window than live in all of eastern Montana--and people like you have the nerve to complain about our highways!
4,555 posted on 02/03/2005 9:37:23 AM PST by HostileTerritory
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To: HostileTerritory
Believe what you like.

It's not a belief, it's factual, and that came out of the Amtrak Reform Council. If you don't believe it, pick up a copy of Amtrak's annual budget, which is available via the FOIA.

The reason this is true is that the western trains run 70% to full, and the average passenger rides a longer distance, so passenger-mile revenue is substantially higher than on the NEC. Last I checked, the Empire Builder made about $30,000 per run, which is why it was increased from a tri-weekly to daily about fifteen years ago.

The NEC is a huge multibillion dollar gimme to the eastern states, that far exceeds the amount of money spent on ag subsidies. Out west, our state budgets pay for our regional and commuter trains. So you honestly think that the Ag budget is greater than the defense budget? Please. While I'll agree that the ag subsidies are of questionable value, the missiles and bombers that protect Massachusetts have to be based inland. And would you honestly prefer that Ag jobs paid as well as manufacturing (what does MA make anymore, now that Route 128 is gone and DEC is dead)? Hope you like paying $10 for a loaf of bread, or $20 a pound for steak...

4,563 posted on 02/03/2005 10:17:27 AM PST by HolgerDansk ("Oh Bother", said Pooh, as he chambered another round.)
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To: HostileTerritory
Excuse me, but since when is every two-bit town entitled to a Class 1 Airport or an interstate-quality road?

They have real weather in Montana and North Dakota. That cute little storm that brought Boston to a standstill recently was nothing compared to typical real winter weather elsewhere. Currently the only dependable long distance transport is by train.

4,574 posted on 02/03/2005 11:37:03 AM PST by HolgerDansk ("Oh Bother", said Pooh, as he chambered another round.)
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