Replies

For me, all politics is first and foremost about the protection of human rights.

Good grief!

Politics may be a great many things, but the protection of human rights is but an issue, not the purpose.

Politics is a function of democracy and governance. It is comprised of thousands of issues, both big and small that either resonate or are ignored.

Human rights were not given by government, nor can they be taken away by same.

We, each and every one of us is responsible for the care taking of our rights and no one can protect them for you.

God gave us rights, and government gives us privileges or takes them.

The last time I checked, politics did not have the face of God. It can't, because it is a game.

Nothing more and nothing less. A game of privileges, not human rights.

If there is any other entity that helps us protect human rights, then that duty falls to the gun.

Methinks you may be in the wrong political party.

Dear Cold Heat,

I apologize that my next remarks may be a little disordered. I'm not a political scientist by training, nor am I well-versed in the theology of the Catholic Church as it applies to social order. I've pinged a few posters who may be better able to more systematically treat the question. Narses, I'm sure you can think of others well-qualified, as well.

Nonetheless, I'll respond to your... comments.

"Human rights were not given by government, nor can they be taken away by same."

I didn't say otherwise.

But human rights are either recognized and respected by governments, or they are not recognized and they are disrespected by governments.

Societies where the state recognizes and respects fundamental human rights are relatively more just than societies where the state does not.

The first goal of a state is to secure a just order. Inherent in just order is the recognition of and respect for fundamental human rights.

Politics is merely what happens when multiple persons gather together to work things out. In the context of government, politics is the means by which different parties, different groups, some competing, some cooperating, work out how the state will function. Moral politics require significant care for, in fact, first attention to just order.

"We, each and every one of us is responsible for the care taking of our rights and no one can protect them for you."

Not quite, Cold Heat. When we erect a state, a government, that corporately respects human rights, through our common efforts, we can secure our rights, at least for the present.

If we must individually secure our rights against the state, if the state takes a dim view of our rights, we will probably each be individually crushed.

That's why Ben Franklin talked about hanging together or being hanged separately.

And that's why the Founders were first and foremost concerned with creating a system of government that limited the power of the state, because they understood that a strong government usually falls into the hands of the strong (at least eventually) and is used to abridge the rights of the weak.

Kinda like what happened with Roe v. Wade. Those who were relatively strong (cultural elites) used someone who was weak (Norma McCovey) to abridge the rights of the even weaker (the unborn, who have no voice of their own).

"God gave us rights, and government gives us privileges or takes them."

Again, nowhere did I say that government gives us rights.

But government can recognize and respect rights, and through just law, can protect and vindicate rights.

"The last time I checked, politics did not have the face of God. It can't, because it is a game."

I don't recall saying it did have the face of God.

And although there are gaming aspects of politics, honest and sincere men try to use politics to achieve moral and just ends.

"Nothing more and nothing less. A game of privileges, not human rights."

Sorry you feel that way. That's really sad. I'll pray for you.

But if that's how you feel, why do you bother? And why get so uptight about it? Who cares if we overturn Roe? Who cares if we wreck the Republican Party? It's just a game, nothing more, nothing less. It has nothing to do with human rights. Right?

"If there is any other entity that helps us protect human rights, then that duty falls to the gun."

Tell that to the folks who lived in totalitarian societies like fascist Germany or communist Russia. Maybe you get to kill the first, second, and third guy through the door. But you won't vindicate your rights in such a place. You won't be able to successfully secure your rights, all by your lonesome and your gun.

The gun is helpful when used by groups of men to aid each other in wresting the government from the tyrant. But it is the persons together, working together for the common cause, that secure the rights of each other. The duty falls to just men acting in concert, not to the gun. The gun is only a tool, appropriate at certain times and places. If it is used only by isolated individuals, it will fail to protect.

Then, having removed the tyrant, men sit and use a new tool - politics, statecraft. If they use it poorly and unjustly, another resort to the gun may not be long in coming. If they use it well, they can secure the rights of themselves, their families, and their progeny for a little while. If those who succeed them use the political tools well, and in concert, when needed, use the gun against common foes, this happy order may persist for some while.

The gun is always available should the state again become a tyrant. Even so, not when borne by a single, lone individual.

Sorry, but humans function through societies. The first society is the family. Legalized abortion demand destroys the just order in this way too, in that it sets the mother against the child as enemies, thus destroying that first society.

"Methinks you may be in the wrong political party."

LOL. If you think the majority of Republicans think that the only way to secure human rights is by the individual wielding a gun, it is you who have badly misjudged the party.

Maybe this is why you oppose overturning Roe? Those damned fetuses ought to fight for themselves! If they want rights, let 'em wield a gun and shoot their way to their rights!! ;-)

sitetest