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To: Ostlandr
"IMHO we need a slower, cheaper, much heavier armored tank for urban warfare."

IIRC - At Kursk the Soviets rolled their big, heavy, slow, un-maneuvrable, very heavily armored tanks (K7? T7?) into the middle of the fight, parked there, and blew the sh** out of the Germans. There does seem to be a time and a place for everything.

882 posted on 11/09/2004 1:39:28 AM PST by norton
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To: norton

Ah, Kursk. The Russian KV-1 heavy tanks were slow, but they did have excellent armor. The T-34 (possibly the best tank of the war) was more like an Abrams- very fast, good armor protection, good (not great) gun.
What happened at Kursk is, the Germans delayed their assault for weeks waiting for the new Panther tanks (arguably the first true modern tank) to be delivered. This gave the Russians time to build up real serious defenses. Most of the Panthers ended up breaking down on the way to the battlefield (tranny problems.)
After the Germans fought their way through the Soviet defenses and began to advance, the Russians counterattacked with a huge armored force. Both forces came up onto the crest of a hill and right into the teeth of each other. It was a knife fight, the close range negating the German armor and gunnery. Imagine two thousand tanks swirling around each other like soldiers in a swordfight. Both sides took horrible losses, but in the end the Germans retreated- the first step in the long retreat back to Berlin.


890 posted on 11/10/2004 9:57:20 PM PST by Ostlandr (Nationalist, small-r republican, fiscal conservative, social liberal, pagan. NOT a Bush partisan!)
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