Harris County (Houston, TX) must remove Bible displayed at courthouse

Houston Chronicle ^ | 8/10/04 | RAD SALLEE

[truthandlife]

.S. District Judge Sim Lake ruled today that a Bible displayed in a monument outside the Harris County Civil Courts Building must be removed within 10 days and that the county must pay $41,000 in court costs and attorney fees.

Real estate broker and attorney Kay Staley sued the county in federal court to have the monument removed, contending the display violates the First Amendment ban on an establishment of religion.

The King James Bible rests under glass inside a 4-foot stone monument on the west side of the Civil Courthouse, 301 Fannin.

The monument was constructed with private funds in the 1950s as a memorial to philanthropist William S. Mosher.

During a two-day hearing last week, the county contended that the display primarily honors Mosher, while the plaintiffs said it unconstitutionally promoted a specific religion at a government facility.

[beelzepug]

Well, my own words coming back to bite me? Nope! I'm getting to be pretty intolerant and, dammit, I just don't care! I'm fed up and there's no medication for that. And if there was I wouldn't take it. I'm getting to where I almost enjoy being perpetually pissed.

[Askel5]

=== I'm getting to be pretty intolerant and, dammit, I just don't care! I'm fed up and there's no medication for that. And if there was I wouldn't take it. I'm getting to where I almost enjoy being perpetually pissed.


Hrm ... my first instinct is to whistle like a boy and cheer.

HOWEVER ... I think being perpetually pissed (as with holding any grudge or hating) is a burden best left to others who don't know any better.

All the best, you unapologetic, practically apoplectic curmudgeon!

[XenaLee]

I've been looking around. Turns out Ms. Staley, aside from being a 60 year old athiest, is also the Treasurer of the River Oaks Area Democratic Women, River Oaks being one of the richer areas of Houston. She's also an activist in ROADwomen for the Democratic Party. What a surprise. Sounds to me like a typical leftist. More money than brains, and too damned much free time on their hands.

http://www.roadwomen.com/Register_Archive/2001/2001-09.pdf

[XenaLee]

I've been looking around. Turns out Ms. Staley, aside from being a 60 year old athiest, is also the Treasurer of the River Oaks Area Democratic Women, River Oaks being one of the richer areas of Houston. She's also an activist in ROADwomen for the Democratic Party. What a surprise. Sounds to me like a typical leftist. More money than brains, and too damned much free time on their hands.

http://www.roadwomen.com/Register_Archive/2001/2001-09.pdf

[XenaLee]

Not that I am aware of. Why? You interested?

[deport]

thanks..... I knew you didn't live in Houston but thought that your work may have taken you to the Court house on occasion. The article is poorly written describing it's location but I assumed it was outside thus the vandalization and trash collection.. Again thanks. Now off to put some road miles in...

[HipShot]

She picked a tame judge, I bet. The whole thing stinks. I wonder what part of town the judge lives in? Political affiliations, etc?

Thanks for the research. Is the decision online somewhere?

[HipShot]

"I'm learning a lot about you."

That's not hard to do. Just ask!

"And -- quite frankly -- I think you need to learn the difference between Judgment and Discerning."

Nope. Your posts pretty much speak for themselves. Discernment is, (IMHO), the greatest of the gifts.

"I've not condemned anyone on this thread for their asinine statements or their calls to "fight fire with fire" or even attempt a run-around by doing what damage they can to the cretin's real estate business."

I'll ask you outright: Was the intent of your posts to protect the reputation of Christianity, or to limit what you see as damage by those within? Applying a little preemptive damage control?

"But thank you for singling me out and lording it over me with the lessons in being a true Christian. Your work is probably never done."

Impaled by the nails of your own conviction? Look at this:

"Stooping to conquer ... how very Christian.

We'll show her what Christianity's all about, eh?"
_____
"Second, I suggest strongly you do seek to understand them. How else will you ever be able to "speak their language" such or have the real sympathy necessary to reach them ... as is your obligation as a Christian."

With these quotes from you in mind, please reread what you wrote to me. I'm not "lording" it over anyone. I'm not telling them what their "obligations" are either. I will stand in defense of another.

"(P.S. The Tick IS cool.)"

Now THERE's discernment. :) Enjoy the remainder of your day.

[Askel5]

=== I'm not telling them what their "obligations" are either.

Perhaps the trouble is that you, like many on this thread, are of a Christian sect instead of adhering to the primary source that is Catholicism.

There are certain objective realities and "non-negotiables" where Christianity is concerned. You can't serve Christ AND Hammurabi. Ends don't justify the means (there is no such thing as the alchemy of pragmatism).

And it's a triumph to be persecuted and rejected by the world ... means you're doing something right.

Those who think to deploy an atheist's tacks to combat the Age of Atheism have a rude awakening ... and perhaps an eternal death ... before them.


Again ... just as there is a difference between discerning and judgment, there is also a difference between making a suggestion and perforce "obligating" someone. Not only do I find it critical to understand my enemies, I fail to see how a person can call themselves "Christian" unless it is the non-Christian to whom they appeal in word and deed. Christ didn't come to save the Perfect.

I probably take a different tack than you as a rule ... I consider it a blessing to be called out by a fellow Christian and rightfully corrected or instructed. That can only help me. What doesn't help is having someone like you upbraid me for my hypocrisy and self-righteousness on a thread wherein the Christians are taking the "When in Rome ..." approach to battling atheists.

I don't have a problem with God's being stripped from the Public Square of the United States. A nation where abortion is the most common elective surgery in the land and whose "Christian" couples exclude the Creator from their bedrooms as they Plan the most intimate and creative and important parts of their lives without Him has no business pretending it's still a Christian nation.

Surely the fact that Bush uses Scripture to sell ESCR in primetime and the Clinton's end public addresses "God bless!" tells you something.

I think the sooner the real persecution of Christians begins, the better it will be for all of us. As it is, they've yet to take the gloves off their Clean Hands. And, in the process, you can see by this thread alone how easily they bring folks to their way of thinking before the battle's even really begun.

[Askel5]

Sorry .. P.S.:

=== I'll ask you outright: Was the intent of your posts to protect the reputation of Christianity, or to limit what you see as damage by those within? Applying a little preemptive damage control?


I'll be honest ... I think this place is increasingly populated by imposters who get their jollies by cranking threads and getting wide-eyed posters to cheer their more absurd and hateful posts.

My "point" generally when replying to one of these outlandish and utterly distasteful or repugnant posts is to:

1 -- Out/Silence a provocateur
2 -- Get the person to think about what they've said.


I guess I don't have the same problem with correction as you. I can probably point you to some pretty vociferous ones I've received over the years ... for all of which I'm still very grateful.

[Chong]

Thanks for the info.

(I wonder if she/it's gonna get freeped?)

[Hand em their arse]

I am begging to see one of these left-wing scumbags on camera rattle on and on and on about why we shouldn't have Bibles in courthouses, prayer in school, Ten Commandments displayed in federal building and just ONE TIME have anyone of some type of clout look them dead in the eye and just say F*CK YOU! Just once, please just once someone just make them feel like a total a-hole in front of hundreds of people and everyone watching at home...

PLEASE!!!!

[Chong]

"I, for one, am really sick of America being taken away from us!"

So am I, but we can do something about it. We don't have to lie down and play dead. Speak up, silent majority, and let our voices be heard. Christians have rights too.

[HipShot]

Thanks for your response. Look to Vatican City in the near future. We, (on the TM thread), have concluded that OBL's reference to breaking "westfalia" refers specifically to an attack on the pope. The AQ "grace period" for Italy expires on the 15th of this month, BTW.
______
I have the impression that were we to continue in the other vein, we'd ultimately be drawing blood. That'd serve neither of us.

[Xenalyte]

To Freepers who are displeased with President Bush: This is what you can expect more of if you don't vote for the man.

As opposed to voting FOR Bush, in which case things like this won't hap - oh, wait, that didn't work. Tell me again what the difference is.

[Xenalyte]

Yo Dix, whatcha know about this Staley broad?

[Xenalyte]

POed ping.

[Askel5]

Nah ... I'm not the least interested in blood sports ... we'd have never gotten that far.


What's the TM thread?

Personally, I believe OBL's dead or in Moscow (scuttlebutt on the latter may be responsible for the Forbe's editor's death, some say).

But even if he were alive, I think he's going for softer targets, not the sexy stuff.

I think the Useful Idiots have hipped to the "Holy War" ... even some atheists "get it". It's more important right now that folks are QUITE CLEAR about why they need be stopped and/or inspected on the highways, in the airports, at their homes for their own Personal safety.

Think: Car Bombs. Totally random car bombs. Fear's the thing.

[Ciexyz]

I remember the days when you could take a Bible to school and read it openly in class, when you could discuss Bible stories in class, when religious groups could form after-school clubs on school property.

Our country has really gone downhill.

[HipShot]

"Threat Matrix". We're on thread 17 now, with approx. 4,000 posts per previous thread.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1188495/posts

We've got some serious cerebral horsepower and some really good eyes. Come visit and participate.