Posted on 07/04/2004 6:08:42 AM PDT by TrebleRebel
Distinct signature found in 01 anthrax Discovery raises hope that source can be traced By Scott Shane Sun National Staff Originally published July 4, 2004 In a possible break for the FBI's investigation of the anthrax letters of 2001, scientists have discovered that the mailed anthrax was a mix of two slightly different samples, giving the bacteria a distinct signature that might make it easier to match with a source, according to two non-government experts who have been told of the finding. The discovery that bacteria taken from the letters all grew in the double pattern was made at least a year ago, and it is not known whether the FBI's hunt for a matching sample has succeeded.
(Excerpt) Read more at baltimoresun.com ...
Thanks -- that makes sense.
"If the difference is the inverted section on plasmid, then we did know that back in 2002. That is the way I read the Read article in Science. I even wrote to a guy at TIGR and he confirmed that I was reading it correctly."
That's beyond me. I do remember first reports in 2001/early 2002 of a "genetic" difference between (I think) the AMI and a senate anthrax - but a scientist, from Stanford I recalled, commented that it might not mean much, there's all sorts of reasons for vairations, etc.
There was also the reports about the difference between the Daschle and Leahy anthrax - one was "clumpy" and looked like "puppy chow." This was later explained as after the fact damage by irradiation, water, or something else.
"There was a question if what was sequenced from Bob Stevens had been influenced by the massive amount of antibiotics he
was given, but they could have, but I never heard the results....compare it with what was in the unopened envelope to the Senator. If they compared the two and they both had the same 50% inversion, then the antibiotics had no effect. It was like that supposedly when they stole it. My scenario is that they stole it by taking a little out of a couple of vials. Then it would not look like any was missing and the thief would be long gone by the time any discovery was made."
My first question would be why the Leahy anthrax wasn't compared to the AMI anthrax, rather than via Stevens' blood. But maybe there wasn't enough found at AMI to make a test...is that true? Sounds a little familiar.
Then there's that story of the Egyptian sailor in Brazil that's never been explained...
Are you sure about this? Where in the Science article does it say that they found genetic differences within the Florida isolate?
Even so, it would be something new. After all, the Science article was about the anthrax delivered to AMI, while it would appear that this new finding is about the NY and DC anthrax ("The discovery that bacteria taken from the letters all grew in the double pattern....").
You're absolutely right -- thank you for the reference. I'd missed that in reading it.
I still think this latest report adds something new, in that it seems to refer to the anthrax mailed to NY and DC, whereas the Science paper is about the FL anthrax. Of course, it's impossible to make a solid judgment about the recent report (no details, no peer review, not even a named source).
I think this analysis might still be of interest today. Below are copies of a couple of posts about this. (I think there were earlier postings, but these are probably the clearest and most complete.)
There do appear to be differences in symptomatology among the various anthrax mailings. It's too early to say whether these differences are caused by genetic differences in the anthrax, different physical preparation of the powder, or some other differences in the patients or the environment.
There are three differences in symptoms, of which two appear to require further explanation:
Differences 1 and 2 above may not be statistically significant, due to very small sample sizes (especially in Florida); but they are suggestive of a difference.
If I had to guess, I'd say that difference 1 would appear to be due to a genetic difference between the FL anthrax and the anthrax distributed in the Northeast. It could also be due to some other difference (a chemical agent added to the NY and/or DC anthrax, or some other aspect of the physical preparation). (Or maybe it's just due to chance. Perhaps Blanco in FL was unusually hardy. But he's quite old, which makes me doubt that it's just chance in this fashion.)
Difference 2 is strange. The same bacterium causes both inhalation and cutaneous anthrax; the difference is just the site of infection. My first inclination was to say that this difference indicates a difference in physical preparation (after all, the whole point of "weaponization" is to make the particles small enough to lodge in the lungs, as well as to make them free of electrical charge so they'll move around easily) or in delivery method. But the delivery methods were apparently the same. And what kind of physical preparation could prevent cutaneous anthrax cases from arising at AMI? The building was heavily contaminated, after all.
So I'm not sure what to make of difference 2. Maybe it indicates a genetic difference as well? There could be different genetic propensities for the bacteria to do differentially better or worse at different infection sites.
Let's analyze this statistically. Take as the null hypothesis the statement that there is no difference between the FL and NJ anthrax. Of the 6 inhalation anthrax survivors, 1 refuses to be interviewed. So, of the 5 we know about, 1 (Blanco) has fully recovered, and 4 are experiencing the syndrome of symptoms described in the article (memory loss, fatigue, joint pain). Assuming the null hypothesis now, all patients were exposed to the same anthrax; this anthrax would then appear to cause this syndrome among about 80% of the survivors (due to genetic differences among patients or other factors). The fully-recovered patient could equally likely have been any one of the five (by the null hypothesis). The probability that the fully-recovered patient (we would expect to have one) would be the patient from FL is 1 out of 5, or 20%.
So I conclude that the probability that this is due to chance (rather than to some difference between the FL and NJ anthrax) is 20%. In statistical terms, we can say that there is a difference between the FL and NJ anthrax at the p=0.8 confidence level. This is not statistically significant (because of the small sample size), but it's high enough to be suggestive. It does add to the weight of other evidence that there is a difference.
In terms of other measures, notice that there doesn't appear to be a difference in mortality rate between the FL anthrax and the NJ anthrax, among the people who contracted the inhalation form of the disease. Fatalities numbered 1 out of 2 cases in FL, and 4 out of 9 cases in the Northeast.
On the other hand, there does appear to be a difference in the site of infection. There were many cases of cutaneous anthrax in the Northeast, but none in FL. This suggests a difference in physical preparation or delivery method, but it's conceivable that a subtle genetic difference could make one type more virulent at a particular site than another.
There's one minor correction to make here. I wrote: ...at the p=0.8 confidence level.
I meant, of course, the 80% confidence level, or, equivalently, p=0.2. (Typically, people would like to see a 95% confidence level, or p <= 0.05, to call something statistically significant.)
This p value of 0.2 is based just on the differential rate of full recovery among survivors in the two populations (FL vs. the Northeast). I suspect that if you also include the difference in cutaneous anthrax incidence rate, the difference may prove to be statistically significant.
Yes, I recall that too. There were supposedly small genetic differences between the FL anthrax and the DC anthrax. What I heard was informal second-hand talk, though, not verifiable published information.
I know of one published article that appears to allude to this. It's a Washington Post article from Aug. 4, 2002, http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&contentId=A40838-2002Aug3. Here's a short excerpt with the relevant allusion:
One law enforcement official confirmed that tests are still underway on the spores recovered from a letter to Sen. Patrick J. Leahy (D-Vt.). "There is still optimism that the science will narrow this thing down further," he said. But he acknowledged that "the science is only going to take us so far."It sounds as if they were saying that they found small genetic differences, but that they weren't sure exactly what to conclude from that.
The problem for analysts is that while they can compare genetic material from different samples, or "isolates," of the Ames strain, they do not yet know how to interpret the mutations that can occur across generations of a bacterium, or even among different bacteria from the same lab and strain.
Why do you think there were no cases of cutaneous anthrax in Florida, while there were so many in the Northeast? That's a peculiar anomaly.
Much of the AMI building was said to have been very heavily contaminated, apparently much more so than any of the New York media buildings -- those buildings weren't shut down for massive clean-ups.
It's doubtful that people in Florida would have fewer nicks and cuts than people in New York. In fact, Floridians typically dress more informally than New Yorkers, so the people at AMI would probably have more exposed skin and fewer layers of clothing.
It really is a very distinctive difference, and it's hard to see what could have caused it.
http://www.globalsecurity.org/org/news/2002/020307-attack02.htm
Which any fully competent biotech fella could have in their garage. It is not unknown in these parts for biotech research gurus to personally own all the gear required to genetically engineer biowarfare agents in a weaponized form. The equipment costs some bucks but isn't that expensive, and is generally readily available. A lot of the biotech equipment made in Russia is particularly cheap and quite serviceable.
What has saved us to date is that it takes more brains than money currently to put something nasty together. And that won't last forever.
So Hatfill is considered a threat to destroy or hide evidence, retaliate against witnesses, or even to go so far as to flee the country? If Lambert really said this, this is an absolutely remarkable statement. It means that either the government still seriously believes that he may have actually done it, or they know he didn't do it but are trying to give the false impression that he's still a suspect.
"The second prong of the AMERITHRAX investigation is
focused on an examination of the anthrax spores which were found within the envelopes mailed to the victims of the attacks."
These are the spores that the Army labs publicly stated were coated with silica to prevent clumping and which other military labs privately stated were also processed with the aid of a polymerized glass binder - a process that was previously unknown to any US bioweaponeers.
These are the same spores that FBI scientist Dwight Adams privately stated had no additives at all.
Who is right and why is this happening? Does the media even care?
I'm shocked, shocked I tell you. That gives them another 4 months to dream up the next delay. I suppose Maureen Stevens will have to wait too.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/health/bal-te.anthrax08jul08,0,5033760.story?coll=bal-health-headlines
Judge delays Hatfill lawsuit until Oct. 7
By Scott Shane
Sun National Staff
Originally published July 8, 2004
After reviewing a secret progress report on the FBI's anthrax investigation, a judge has confirmed his postponement of Dr. Steven J. Hatfill's lawsuit against the federal government for at least three more months.
U.S. District Judge Reggie B. Walton signed an order Tuesday delaying proceedings in the lawsuit until Oct. 7, when he will again review the investigation. Government lawyers had sought the postponement, saying that Hatfill's lawyers' requests for documents and depositions would interfere with the case.
On Tuesday, Walton reviewed a classified declaration written by Richard Lambert, the FBI inspector in charge of the investigation of the anthrax-laced letters that killed five people in 2001. The declaration was then "stored in an appropriate secure container at the Department of Justice," according to court papers.
Hatfill, a former Army biowarfare expert at Fort Detrick in Frederick, denies any connection to the attacks.
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