Your papers, please

The Washington Times ^ | February 23, 2004 | House Editorial

[xsysmgr]

Next week the U.S. Supreme Court will hear a case to decide whether or not all Americans must have identification on them at all times. The case has been brought by a cowboy in Nevada who was asked to show ID while he was leaning against his pickup truck on the side of the road near his ranch. The police officer did not offer any specific reason why he demanded proof of identity. Having committed no crime, Dudley Hiibel, the cowboy, refused -- and was arrested. He was later convicted for "Delaying a Peace Officer." In America, still a free country, citizens should not be required to provide identification papers at any whim of the authorities.

[sailor4321]

Hmmmm...I refuse to identify myself because doing so might tend to incriminate me?

[grobdriver]

It would be a shame if cowboys were required to carry a driver's license to ride a horse while roaming the open range.

All the cowboy needs to carry is his .45. An automatic, preferably, but a wheel-gun if he must.

[af_vet_rr]

In the dissent, Justice Deborah Agosti argues that merely knowing an individual's identity does not enhance safety.

Hard to argue with that. From the video it was pretty clear the cop was just fishing, and wouldn't even inform the guy of what was going on. "Investigating an investigation" my butt.

[Wonder Warthog]

"I refuse to identify myself because doing so might tend to incriminate me?"

No, you refuse to identify yourself because you just, by damn, don't want to. That's perfectly legitimate UNLESS the law officer has some justifiable reason for asking. The smartass deputy in this case obviously did not, and was just exercising his "jack-booted thug" psychological tendencies.

Said deputy should have been fired as soon as the sheriff heard of this incident. Said deputy should STILL be fired.

[sauropod]

Oh goody. More cards we shall have to carry around.

I think that the cowboy should carry around a copy of the BoR and whip out the 4th amendment next time Johnny Lawdog decides he is conducting an "investigation of an investigation."

[Lord_Baltar]

Well, to borrow from some of the words used around here to defend the Patriot Act, "Don't they know there's a War on Terrorism going on?" "They should be happy to cooperate" and my personal favorite "If they have nothing to hide, they have nothing to fear".

Face it Folks, this sort of thing is just the tip of the iceberg....

[upchuck]

Hmmmm... the LEO trying to out-cowboy the cowboy?

And this joke made it all the way to the Supremes?

Methinks something is outa whack here.

[DJ Frisat]

Mr. Kyl, if you want to scan retinas and capture fingerprints electronically, how about directing your efforts at EVERY FOREIGN VISITOR WHO CROSSES OUR BORDERS FOR ANY REASON? And don't forget those illegal immigrants that we're so eager to give drivers' licenses, health care and Social Security benefits to.

Sheesh, the "leaders" in this country have it all backwards.

[Chip_Douglas]

I live in New Hampshire and im a young guy. Any time im walking somewhere, the cops stop me and card me. They always use the same excuse "there's been alot of robberies in the neighborhood" when I know theres not since I live there.

[Lady Eileen]

bump

[Veritas_est]

Hmmmm...I refuse to identify myself because doing so might tend to incriminate me?

Has the concept of freedom so escaped our citizenship? Do you actually think it should be a crime to not have, or produce identification at the whim of every "jack booted thug" with a badge?

Now mind you I do support law enforcement. In this case, and untold numbers of other cases, there was not even the suggestion of a crime. "Fishing trips" for wrong doing does not justify proof of identification.

Since when does one need to identify oneself for the privilege of watching traffic go by?

The concept of freedom seems to be dying in this once great nation.

[Izzy Dunne]

What this story does NOT say is that there was an anonymous report of domestic violence between Hiibel and his daughter. Aparrently his daughter hit HIM, but that part didn't make it thru. The officer was responding to that, which is why he stopped to begin with.

That doesn't make any of it right, but the article could have stated it.

The video and whole story is available here.

[Izzy Dunne]

there was not even the suggestion of a crime.

Actually, there was. Why the article doesn't say so, I don't know.
Not that it makes it right.
See here.

[Izzy Dunne]

What this article also does NOT say is that after Hiibel was cuffed and sitting in the patrol car, OTHER officers were lying on top of his daughter, who had escaped the truck (after the officer had tried to keep her shut in it.

See the video.

[Eric in the Ozarks]

Another authoritarian prick cop. Hope there comes a time when he needs an average Joe's assistance...

[cynicom]

Expect O'Connor to once again side with her brethern on the left.

[grellis]

My one and only arrest was for not having photo id on me while driving here in Lansing. I was pulled over for a routine traffic stop (failure to yield, which I fought and won, BTW) and didn't have my license on me. I had credit cards, my social security card, and was able to tell the officer my license number, to no avail. Cuffed, hauled in, fingerprinted, mug-shotted, the whole nine yards. I wasn't goading the officer into it or anything--my husband was an MP at the time and I know enough to be "Yessirnosir" in this kind of situation. When I asked the officer why he felt it was necessary to go to such lengths he explained that if I were to die in an auto accident it would be difficult to identify me. Yadda yadda...as I said, I had id on me, just not my license.

I am not really upset about what happened. The law in Lansing is you must have your license with you while driving. I broke the law so there you go. What really pi$$es me off is that our local officers won't issue tickets to our local drug dealers for loitering because they never show proper id.

[corlorde]

I think we should all be forced to get tracking chips implanted under our skin so the government can track out location and get an immediate history(crime, court, medical, finacial) any time they want. See, we won't have to carry any papers....NOT!

[johnny7]

I'm not too worried about the 'Patriot Act'... as long as it sticks to it's original purpose. I do worry when I see local law enforcement harassing innocent citizens to make revenue while avoiding the real thugs who roam the streets. In another words... PC policemen.