Is it worth the money to step foot on Mars?

Mountain Reporter ^ | 1-21-04 | Steven Stiefel

[ambrose]

Sand Mountain Reporter
http://sandmountainreporter.com

Copyright © 2004 Sand Mountain Reporter

Is it worth the money to step foot on Mars?

By Steven Stiefel
Sand Mountain Reporter

Published January 22, 2004

Should we return to the moon and step foot on Mars?

That?s the agenda set by President George W. Bush in hopes of winning re-election. Certainly, that would have a huge impact on Marshall County citizens who work for NASA in Huntsville.

Some might argue we have plenty of urgent needs here at home, that we should make sure no child goes without a textbook before spending billions to reach for the stars.

I believe in the benefits of space exploration: inspiring those children to learn math and science, propelling human imagination as surely as the actual rocketships. I believe in the human drive to learn more about the universe and our role in it. I believe in the future of mankind, my future descendants colonizing the galaxy just as my predecessors carved a great nation out of wilderness.

Many benefits of America?s space program are tangible enough to see and take for granted every day.

Among the products we use today that would not have been without the U.S. Space program: satellites, fire-resistant materials, sewage treatment, wireless communications, firefighter air tanks, winter tires, engine coatings, lightweight cutters to free accident victims, computer chips used for digital imaging breast biopsies, ultrasound scanners, insulin pumps, MRIs, radiation insulation, hydroponics, aerodynamically-efficient corporate jets, safer bridges, emission testing, electric cars, auto design, new semiconductors, structural analysis used by auto manufacturers, air quality monitors, virtual reality, global positioning systems used in navigation, microcomputers, enriched baby foods, water purification systems, scratch-resistant lenses, pool purification technology, energy-saving air conditioning, competition swimsuits, golf ball aerodynamics, portable coolers/warmers, cardiovascular sports training, athletic shoes, Dustbuster, shock-absorbing helmets, home security systems, smoke detectors, flat panel TVs, high-density batteries, trash compactors, food packaging and freeze-dried technology, sports bras, weather forecasting technology, laser angioplasty, microlasers for precision welding, and interactive computer training.

Have these inventions been worth the money we have invested as taxpayers? Just think of the lives saved and the efficiency measures that allow American companies to remain competitive internationally.

Out of a $1.5 trillion budget, less than 1 percent is spent on the entire space program.

Conservative estimates are for every dollar the U.S. government spends on the space proram, it receives $7 back in the form of corporate and personal income taxes from increased jobs and economic growth.

There will be those who say it is foolish to look at that big rock in the night sky, but future wonders await us. Just think what new minerals might be waiting elsewhere, allowing us to build stronger equipment or providing links that lead to solving diseases here on Earth.

We?ll never know unless we go. Tell your congressmen you support space exploration.

 

 

[ambrose]

But don't ask Americans to pay for your trillion dollar photo op fantasy, which will lead to exactly what Apollo led to.........nothing.

Apollo led to "nothing" because NASA/Congress/President dropped the ball when the sheeple grew bored with exploration. Even back in the 60's, the plan was lunar base, then on to Mars and beyond.

Photo-op is planting a flag and leaving. Changing the course of humanity is colonizing Mars, harvesting its resources, and then on to Titan and beyond.

[ambrose]

And no, I don't want the Red Chinese to have unchallenged access to the Moon from which they can lob missles at us, unchallenged.

[Ophiucus]

Does anyone actually believe this hyperbole?

Hyperbole? That list doesn't even scratch the surface.

Ever know anyone who had a heart attack, needed a transfusion, cardiac monitoring, angioplasty, MRI, CAT scan, microsurgery, vascular surgery, mammography, biopsy, etc? The space program helped to revolutionize medicine.

Every part of daily life and the quality of medical care has products from the space program.

Would they have been developed without it? Some - maybe, others - probably not. Nothing is invented until there is a need - and space forced inventors to conceive the previously inconceivable. Nothing invented can ever hit the marketplace without venture capital.

Significant events in pioneering never had private funding. This country would not have been discovered, founded, fulfilled a sea to sea manifest destiny without state funding.

It takes a large vision to trail blaze in history and it needs the support of a society willing to thrive and grow to support it.

For this government, it is one of the few times it spends money on an investment and one the rare uses of taxes for the "general welfare."

[Ophiucus]

Only if NASA does it with voluntary donations.

Right. What momentous event of human history was ever financed by voluntary donations?

"Excuse me, would you donate to the Future of Humanity Fund? We'd like to colonize other planets so the race doesn't curl up and die here."

The time has come to say no to every new government program that comes along,

War on Terror? New border security to stem illegals?
Sorry - read the sign - NO new programs of any kind.
What? New planes and guns for the military?
But we have perfectly good WWII surplus still....

This is just a more "upscale" welfare program designed to transfer the wealth of the workers to those in government graces.

What a load - even for a propaganda phrase. Want a tastier pop-tart? Use private funding. Want to cure a disease, save live with new operative technique and equipment, want to explore an uncharted area? This is one area where government funds actually are spent improving the standard of life for all. But then, your reasoning has the people at Mayo, JPL, etc. in the same line with the crack hookers.

[Texasforever]

This is just a more "upscale" welfare program designed to transfer the wealth of the workers to those in government graces.

Do you consider yourself a conservative?

[Ophiucus]

Damn the Luddites. Full speed ahead!

The voice of progress....*sigh* How dare you propose using tax dollars to help the human race to the future, you evil b***ard.

/sarcasm

[stopsign]

Ok...Ok, girl frend... You got me. :)<< me

[Ophiucus]

And don't forget to tax them after you are through ridiculing them.

Funny how you want their money, not their opinion.

If their opinion wasn't heaping scorn on invention, exploration, progress, while rehashing disingenuous Luddite philosophies, there might be less ridicule.

Remember - it is our taxes too. Much better to invest it than waste it.

[Ophiucus]

You're right to point the hyperbole out. It's all part of a PR game they play and most of the items on your list are developed for profit and not for space exploration.

Guess what - most of those products never would have been developed, let alone made it out of a lab if it hadn't been for the initial requirements of space and the space program. Profit development occurred afterward when someone thought, hey a little advertising and I could sell that.

Items, especially in science, are not invented for profit first. They are invented for a need first. Profit comes from re-tasking the original invention.

The needs of going to the moon accelerated the process incredibly. That is the reality of spin-off technology, not the PR game.

[LibWhacker]

Ha! Wait'll they hear the REST OF THE SECRET PLAN: We also need $100 quadrillion dollars to send men across time and across dimensions to the Omega point! ;-)

[Ophiucus]

Why stop there? Hell, as long as we're spending money we don't have, let's go to Venus, or Jupitor...

You're almost thinking logically. The next step would be Jupiter - then Alpha Centauri or nearest star with rocky inner planets, like Earth and Mars. Progress takes time - and money. But the future should be worth it.

By the way, Bush's proposal was less than 0.7% of the total budget.

[stopsign]

Hummm... what Ophiucus said. :)<<me

[Ophiucus]

I am getting sick of this crap! ....

The funny thing is, the spinoffs are everyday household items, the clowns that protest these advancements and shrug that someone else would have done it, haven't a clue! They just take advantage of these technologies b^%tch and moan about them! Irony?

Bravo, keep fighting the good fight.

[Ophiucus]

Just keep the facts straight. 35 years after Columbus and L&C, thousands of settler were following them on THEIR OWN DIME.

Yes, please keep the facts straight and straight facts show that you are grossly incorrect. As Rimmer from "Red Dwarf" would say," Wrong, wrong, simply brimming with wrongability."

No settlers could afford to "follow on their own dime." The expenses to mount an expedition for a new settlement were astronomical. Therefor the colonies were granted charters by the Crown to Crown companies who used capital, from the Crown and tax breaks for their own levies, to supply the first expeditions. The colonists were employees or bonded to the companies. Some colonies, like Maryland, were deeded directly to relatives of the immediate royal family and again, used monies of the Crown to finance colonization. Other colonies like South Carolina were owned directly by the King and settled by his loyal supporters and paid for by the Crown once again. Finally, Georgia was settled as a penal and debtors colony - every penny paid for by the government.

Even the early attempts by the Dutch and the Spanish were paid by the Crown, in the case of Spain, or paid for by a government agency in the case of the Dutch West Indies Company.

Settlers paying their own way didn't occur until after the colonies were established and growing on their own. Even then, it wasn't as common as generally assumed. That would be in the late 1600's and early 1700's - long after your "35 years and thousands."

Throughout human history, exploration, colonization, and necessary technological advances have been financed by a government or governing body. It is a task that requires the focus of a society - not individuals - and not a charity foundation.

[Ophiucus]

We also need $100 quadrillion dollars to send men across time and across dimensions to the Omega point

SSSHHHHH!!!! The Omega conspiracy is a secret!

[solitas]

I'd suggest that is overly cautious and the wrong approach. It certainly isn't the approach used in the 60s. I favor immediate colonization of Mars. The biggest sticking point to going to Mars is the inablity to return back to Earth. Problem solved when we turn this into a colonization mission.

The approach used in the 1960's was 'gung-ho' and it DID work after 10 years and lotsabucks and several lives. All for 'pissing rights' that we got there first - which is not a politically-incorrect thing to say.

Immediate colonization? Good - let 'em waste YOUR money and not MINE. "sticking point"? You have a talent for understatement. Nothing has ever come back from Mars yet (hell, they've enough problems sending relatively simple mechanical constructs there one-way already, let alone the mechanical resources that would be necessary for a return trip, not to mention the provisioning/environment necessary to support the meatbags making the trip). How about "problem[s] solved BEFORE we turn this into a colonization mission"? AND, with at least a year-plus encompassing a launch-to-splashdown trial, you could do a hell of a lot of Moon-testing (a week round-trip would be a lot) still using hard vacuum and getting into/out of the Moon's gravity well and transit time as your test conditions.

[solitas]

As if the R&D departments at Goodrich and the other tire companies would not have developed them?

hey- tires are used on the shuttles, therefore tires must have been developed for space exploration. There are seat coverings on the shuttle, therefore naugahyde was born. 10-32 x 1/4" buttonhead cres screws...light bulbs for indicators...ALUMINUM!...rubber for gaskets...the list is never ending (oh, yeah, and Tang®). :)

[SkyRat]

If there's gold, then maybe, MAYBE, it will pay a corporation to send a colony.

Gold?
You got to be kidding. For what is gold useful exactly? What I would look for would be metals in general, water, exotic stuff like helium-3. What can also of great value would be simply space. A big, unsettled place to got to.
But just suppose there would be a big gold deposit somewhere on a near planet. Wouldn't the value of gold drop?

I'm pretty surprised, really. Since you were talking about settlers going to : Do you think they were looking for gold? Prosperity in a general sense, freedom, yes, but gold?

I'm sorry but I can't understand that. I hope you can answer my questions. Why would you support a mission if gold was found? Wouldn't that mean a drop in value for gold? Isn't helium-3 also a expensive resource?

To make my position clear, I'm for space exploration and even more for colonization, simply because I believe civilization which don't expand, collapse. Since the earth is crowded, we need a new place. I'm pretty sure, people would be happy to colonize if the infrastructure was available. So, we got to build it.

From my point of view gold is simply irrelevant.

[Atlas Sneezed]

>The space program helped to revolutionize medicine.

>Nothing is invented until there is a need

>Nothing invented can ever hit the marketplace without venture capital.

---

The above statements qualify as more hyperbole.

[Petronski]

For what is gold useful exactly?

Non-oxidizing electrical contacts.