BUSH OFF KEY IN SINGING PRAISES OF PAROCHIAL SCHOOLS

PhxNews ^

[attagirl]

Those NEA/DOE types are everywhere. The comment about having to educate all was a red herring. I am not sure if Catholic/private schools have to adhere to "mainstreaming" rules with regards to special ed. That's another problem. I've seen moms at a board of ed meeting complaining how this one autistic kid makes the class bedlam.

The best thing a parent can do is get his kid to read aloud to him at night to see how the student is doing.

Also, he should stay involved with the homework situation so as to see what is going on in class. Even if the child is responsible and does his work, the parent should be there. Later is when problems surely will occur (if not from the get-go) and you want the pattern established of keeping your foot in the door.

This does 2 things--monitor the progress and see what crazy curricula is being used and what is taught. (Harry Potter is required reading in many schools.)

[Askel5]

Amen ...

Heaven help those Useful Idiots who believe the Feds come bearing gifts where vouchers are concerned.

[Askel5]

=== In New Orleans, for instance, only 6% of enrolled students in Catholic schools are African-American.


This seems hard to believe.

[buwaya]

Having seen a large number of Catholic and other schools at work, I would say that the primary advantage, in terms of absolute performance, Catholic and other private schools have is that they take a better "slice" of the school age population. On average, the fact that tuition is charged filters out most of the underclass or would-be underclass. You get a similar effect by moving between school districts. This effect is pretty well understood, and is even quite predictable, mathematically, using tools like the California DOE SCI index.

On top of that, though, there are specific effects of private schools, unfortunately these are not easy to quantify if at all, as there is little useful comparative testing done in private schools.

The first is the fact that private schools and Catholic schools do not accept difficult students, and can expel students if necessary. This gives them a huge advantage in productivity.

The second is that there is a much more pragmatic approach to curriculum, and faddishness there tends to be either limited or applies only to populations who won't be hurt much by it.

[Romulus]

The figure must include suburban schools, which are all part of the same Archdiocesan system. Even so, I'm surprised too that it's so low.

[The_Eaglet]

I think that many who support vouchers see it as an alternative to direct grants, and they don't understand that education is not an enumerated power of the federal government. They see it as a more "conservative" approach because parents can direct to some extent their choice in schools.

What they don't realize is that they need to pursue this issue on state and local levels, not at the federal. Even then, it's dangerous on the state level because it encourages dependency on government, and in most states that is at the expense of those who pay property or income tax.

[The_Eaglet]

Rescuing system next target of reformers[?] - Campaign Finance Reform thread-day 34

[Little Bill]

I was sent to a Catholic Prep school back in the sixties, a test school, if you passed you were accepted. We had a lot of Jewish students, and a lone Protastant, me, it was hard.

The courses were, 4 years Latin, two of a modern language along with the Latin, 4 years math, 3 years History, 4 years English, Civics, two science electivs and religion, exempt, if you were Jewish plus the usual rat propiganda.

[buwaya]

This is not the typical curriculum of a parochial high school, even back then. More likely one would not get Latin. One probably would not get Calculus in 12th grade.
As you say, you went to something of an elite school.

Parochials are the bread and butter of Catholic schools, the ones for the masses. They usually didn't and don't use examinations for entry. Parochials typically are built using land belonging to the Archdiocese and often with capital provided by the Archdiocese. The goal is to make them affordable, this goal is often not quite achievable.

There are a minority of Catholic schools, generally run by the religious orders (such as Dominicans and Jesuits), that are financed independently of the Archdiocese. Affordability is not generally an issue, so tuition for these can be quite high, and they often rely on entrance tests. They are sometimes a cash cow for religious orders, but for the Jesuits at least they are a continuation of a long-standing policy to educate the elite in a Catholic tradition.

[ShadowDancer]

This is not the typical curriculum of a parochial high school, even back then. More likely one would not get Latin. One probably would not get Calculus in 12th grade.

I disagree. My father graduated from U of D in the middle fifties and his curriculum matched that posters and then some (toss in Greek, etc.). There was nothing elite about his family, to the contrary they were pretty damn poor. You save where you can for what matters most to you.

[buwaya]

Well, by elite I mean that that school is not typical.

It certainly would not be typical today. Of 7 Catholic high schools in San Francisco, I think only two or three offer Latin.

[rdb3]

On the contrary, I am anti-voucher and want government out of the education business.

It's always nice to know who your enemies are.

[Little Bill]

It was the typical "Classical" course in the public schools also, except you only had to take two years of a language. I will admit that many of my teachers had taught at the university level, first years of coeducational education for that order, but it wasn't an unusual curriculum for that time even in Government Schools.

[buwaya]

Strike that last - of 7 Catholic High Schools in SF, only one offers Latin.

[gueroloco]

"It's always nice to know who your enemies are"

I'm not quite sure if you are labeling me an enemy for my stance against vouchers or if you agree with my desire to see government get out of the education business. Vouchers entail government involvement and ultimately control over all aspects of the curriculum. Considering the wonderful job the gubmint has done with its public schools (NOT), private/parochial schools would be foolish to cede educational authority to proven amateurs.

[gueroloco]

Special ed is probably the one area where private/parochial schools cannot compete with public schools, largely due to financial resources. I like the things you said about parental involvement in their child's education. That is critical, and far too many parents abdicate their responsibility!

[johndpringle]

I suspect your call would be put through immediately. If the Bishop was not there then my guess is they would page him. You would be taken care of.

[attagirl]

Special ed is probably the one area where private/parochial schools cannot compete with public schools, largely due to financial resources.

And it's probably better left to the public schools. Unfortunately, there's a vast increase in autism* and other disorders, so it bodes very bad for the tax situation.

* a whole different subject

[attagirl]

The first is the fact that private schools and Catholic schools do not accept difficult students, and can expel students if necessary. This gives them a huge advantage in productivity. That's a fair statement. I agree. And those who are there have parents who have made an investment in their future.

The second is that there is a much more pragmatic approach to curriculum, and faddishness there tends to be either limited or applies only to populations who won't be hurt much by it. Please see my post 37. This is vitally important.

However, eternal vigilance--esp. since we are mired in this putrescence all around us.

[Dave Olson]

American Atheists is a nationwide movement, which defends the civil rights of nonbelievers, works for the separation of church and state...

Then in order to be consistent, they also need oppose:
- Pell Grants and the GI Bill for allowing tax dollars to be spent on religious colleges and universities.
- Medicare and Medicaid for allowing tax dollars to be spent on religious hospitals.
- Social Security for allowing tax dollars to be spent on everything from Kosher food to TV preachers.