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See the numbers adjacent to the holes? That's the number corresponding to the computer card ballot. Bush/Cheney is #3, Buchanan/Foster (I still enjoy calling them Bananas/Foster) is #4 and Gore/Lieberman is #5. #1 and #2 are on the card but they are not associated with *any* race on the ballot.

There is no #2 to punch on the machine and if the fraud specialists were jamming coathangers into the #2 hole on a stack of ballots, it would only prove to the world that these were all fraudulent ballots. If you don't pop the computer card into the machine well enough, the only result is that your intended vote would go to a candidate *lower* on the ballot, not higher. That means a vote for Gore where the voter didn't push their card in deep enough would have counted for the Socialist McReynolds, not Buchanan.

So telling the old ladies to "vote Number Two" would make no sense unless that was shorthand for voting for the second name on the ballot - a command that still would have confused someone who saw two names that might possibly be the second name (the one underneath Bush or the one to the right of Bush).

Maybe I'm belaboring a point that is not necessary but the fraud would have been to punch hole #4 when they meant to punch hole #5, both in the butterfly ballot and on the computer card.

Right. We can't tell how people who were told to "vote for number two" interpreted that command. It probably explains some of the Buchanan-Gore double punches.

But we don't know exactly how many those were: the VERY FEW reports that supposedly hand-counted double-punched ballots were in a few carefully-selected groups from carefully-selected precincts in carefully-selected counties, analyzed by democrat agents and reported by democrat supporters.

To resolve the mess, you MUST re-run ALL the Palm Beach and Broward ballots by precinct, and then report ALL the double-punched ballots (not merely discard them, as is done automatically!). Further, you need to know how many blank ballots were sent for the president, for the Senate races, and how how many total voters came in.

Then, find out how many Senate votes were double-punched, compared to how many presidential ballots. Find out how many other random errors happened in other races across the ballot. Find out exactly which presidential ballots were duoble-punched for each candidate.

Unfortunately, we aren't permitted to re-run the ballots through the counting machines again to look explicitly for double-punched ballots, and report what positions were double-punched.

There are many tales that could be proved false.

But it would require re-running the ballots for Palm Beach, Broward, and Miami-Dade. Also to compare those with Orlando and Jacksonville, where no corruption has ever been discovered.

'Course, Orlando (Orange Cty) and Jacksonville (Duval Cty I believe) were NOT run by a corrupt democrat machine.

no, fraud is a deliberate attempt to re-punch a ballot, or to remove a valid vote, or to "create" a counted vote where no previous vote existed.

A "mistake" happens when a confused (or mis-instructed!) voter punches the wrong place. Here, the "number two from the top", instead of the "number two spot on the first page" In the back room, the "number two" punched hole ..

Or "number four punched hole" as you indicate? How many Bush votes got cancelled when number 2 hole was punched? How many Gore votes got cancelled?

Mistakes are not fraud though.

'Course, it does indicate the stupidity of the average democrat voter if that's how the democrats gave instructions.

Why not tell them to "vote for Gore, or you'll lose Social Security and the republicans will starve your children and pollute the environment!"

(Oh wait. They did that too.)