Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: CCWoody
It's only out of your context Woody.

To answer your question, God can do anything he wants to. If He wanted to he could format the hard drive and wipe us all out and start over from scratch.

He chooses not to.

Calvinists seem to imply that God giving man a choice somehow weakens God. To the contrary. God created us to love Him. Love requires a choice.

A choice He gives us.

167 posted on 02/27/2002 8:18:34 AM PST by Ward Smythe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 161 | View Replies ]


To: Ward Smythe; xzins; Jerry_M; Jean Chauvin; RnMomof7
You agree that God created them with certain abilities and desires, for God has created all of us. You agree that God has created us with the foreknowledge that He already knows who will not come to Him. You agree that God created them anyway. He saw our substance while it was still unformed and in His book he has already written the days that were fashioned for us, when there were none of them.

One more question: if God has desired and been pleased to do so, could He have created a man differently, with a different set of abilities and desires so that the man would eventually submit to Him? - CCWoody

To answer your question, God can do anything he wants to.... He chooses not to.

Exactly the Calvinist point! God, and God alone, in eternity foreknew exactly what the consequences of His actions in Creation would be upon each and every single soul who has ever lived. God, with perfect foreknowledge, has given each and every single man a certain set of abilities, desires, even location in time and the world, with the perfect foreknowledge of exactly how His choice would Predestine that man's eventually eternal resting place. God, with perfect foreknowledge, could have chosen a different course had He been pleased to do so.

ROMANS 8: 28 - 30
And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose. For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

This is the Truth of Scripture, evidenced clearly enough for all to see in what has been called "The Golden Chain of Predestination" in Romans 8: 28 - 30:

God's Foreknowledge of the Eternal Destiny of Men is NOT BASED on His Predestination.
God's Predestination of the Eternal Destiny of Men is BASED UPON His Foreknowledge.

"For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son."

No one can deny that those whom God has Predestined as to their Everlasting Destiny, He first Foreknew as to their Salvation. The exact number, and the every name, of every individual of whom God has Predestined to be called, and justified, and sanctified, and glorified, these very same ones He first Foreknew that He would Save.

The question is not whether God's Predestination of the Saints as to their ultimate Glorification is, or is not, based upon His Foreknowledge as to their Salvation. God has Predestinated based upon His Foreknowledge, that is certain enough.

The Question is this, and this specifically: ON WHAT BASIS has God Foreknown those whom He would Predestine??

Thus, I believe that you should see that God's foreknowledge of the Salvation of His Elect is based ultimately upon His Foreknowledge of His Own actions towards them.

Grant God’s perfect Foreknowledge of All Potentialities, and Sovereign Freedom of Action [i.e. to either choose or not choose as you have done so], and you have just given the Calvinist the entirety of the debate. For if God, alone in Eternity, perfectly Foreknows all possible Creations, and perfectly Foreknows the operations of Free Will in each, from Beginning to End, and with Sovereign Freedom of Action Wills to give Actuality to the Creation of His choosing, then simply by the Act of Creation, He has Predestined all that will occur in that Creation -- having chosen to give Actuality to That One, in preference to all other Potential Creations which He could have willed into existence instead.

171 posted on 02/27/2002 8:56:03 AM PST by CCWoody
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 167 | View Replies ]

To: Ward Smythe
It seems to me that since God has not chosen to re-format our hard drives, then mankind can't be as evil as a lot of people say.
172 posted on 02/27/2002 9:02:34 AM PST by stuartcr
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 167 | View Replies ]

To: Ward Smythe
1John 4:19 "We love because he first loved us." We can't love God without first being born of God and knowing God.
377 posted on 02/28/2002 12:50:58 AM PST by irishtenor
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 167 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson