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To: L,TOWM
Thank you! I find intelligent design a fascinating but much maligned theory.

Here is another of the points of this debate I find passing strange. If the Big Bang theory is proven accurate, and the evidence is piling up, doesn't it prove a moment of creation? And doesn't creation imply the existence of a creator? So why do Darwinist scientists so strongly reject the implications of a created universe?

Freeregards.

139 posted on 02/05/2002 1:34:50 PM PST by colorado tanker
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To: colorado tanker
why do Darwinist scientists so strongly reject the implications of a created universe?

Follow that thought. If there is a designer, there was a reason for what was designed. That means you are'nt the greatest thing in existence. It also means that some (or one) manner of living may actually have an advantage over others.

It means maybe, just maybe, a certain responsibillity for moral actions may be in the works. And that concept can be terrifying. Almost as terrifying as ineveitable, complete non-existence.

144 posted on 02/05/2002 1:50:15 PM PST by L,TOWM
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To: colorado tanker
If the Big Bang theory is proven accurate, and the evidence is piling up, doesn't it prove a moment of creation? And doesn't creation imply the existence of a creator? So why do Darwinist scientists so strongly reject the implications of a created universe?

Just addressing this superficially, the common definition of concepts such as "moment of creation" break down when talking about something like the Big Bang hypothesis. It is very hard for the human mind to conceive of things where normal concepts of "time" and "space" don't apply. Physics frequently uses metaphors from the common language to describe things that have mathematical properties that can differ substantially from common usage.

I don't think Darwinists strongly reject the concept of a creator so much as the people who posit a creator for the universe do so using naive assumptions and necessities that aren't actually correct in the context of the theory. In other words, the metaphors by which many people understand physics break long before you actually get to the point of the creation of the universe, and therefore so do many of the ideas based on those metaphors. To have really meaningful discussions of such things, you kind of have to get into the descriptive mathematics.

On the other hand, positing a creator for the universe also seems to create necessary consequences that people approaching this from a strictly religious standpoint aren't comfortable with. So while I think many "Darwinists" would be willing to entertain the idea of a creator (as it is not excluded by the theory of evolutionary speciation), it would likely be a creator that doesn't fit neatly into the religious doctrine of some individuals. I've seen as much heat between religious fundamentalists and what you could call rational creator theory as you do between the religious fundamentalists and the atheists on the same topic. All of which tends to indicate to me that these discussions are just a proxy argument for other issues the religious fundamentalists have in my opinion.

154 posted on 02/05/2002 2:11:15 PM PST by tortoise
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