THE EFFECTS OF REGENERATION

All men are by nature the children of wrath, and are under the power of darkness. In this state men are not the subjects of Christ's kingdom and have no fitness for heaven. From this terrible state they are unable to deliver themselves. (I John 5:19; Romans 5:6) Out of this state they must be supernaturally called.(I Peter 2:9; Colossians 1:13) This divine "call" or work of grace is called in Scriptures as: REGENERATION (Titus 3:5); TRANSFORMATION (II Cor.3:18); THE NEW BIRTH, ILLUMINATION (II Cor. 4:6); SPIRITUAL RESURRECTION (John 5:24). This inward call is attended with justification and adoption and conversion,(which includes faith and repentance). (Romans 8:30; Eph. 1:5; Eph.2:1-10) Thus leading us to the EFFECTS OF REGENERATION.

Jesus in John 3:8 tells us of this matter, speaking of the blowing of the wind. Man is unable to originate, order or regulate the wind. Man knows very little of the cause which controls the wind, yet the presence of the wind is unmistakable; and its EFFECTS are plainly evidenced, "SO IS EVERY ONE THAT IS BORN OF THE SPIRIT." BUT THE TRANSFORMING RESULTS BECOME PLAIN.

The illumination of the understanding Gen. 1 "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth." Then:" the earth was without form and void and darkness was upon the face of the deep." Next: "And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters," and God said: "Let there be light."

So it is when God begins to restore fallen man: "For God who commanded the light to shine out of the darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ." (II Cor. 4:6)

This Divine illumination is not by dreams, visions, or mere feelings, but the revelation of things to his mind and soul which have been all along in sacred Scriptures. Now the blessed Holy Spirit removes the blindfold from his eyes and opens his heart to receive the written Word. (Acts 16:14) Then He begins to powerfully apply to the mind and conscience some portion of it. The result is that the one renewed is able to say, "One thing I know, that, whereas I was blind, now I see." (John 9:25)

To be more particular, The sinner is now enlightened in the knowledge of his own terrible condition. He may earlier have known many Bible facts, even doctrinal statements, received much instruction; BUT NOW, the solemn declarations of God's Word concerning his fallen state are brought home in piercing power to him. He no longer justifies himself by comparison with his fellow man, he measures himself by the law of God. He is now terribly convicted by his own uncleanness and wickedness before a thrice holy God. ( Isaiah 1:6; 64:6)

By this new spiritual light which God communicates in REGENERATION he now sees that the "wages" he has earned by sin deserve eternal death. That he has placed himself under the awful wrath of God. He now realizes that he has lived his whole life in utter independence of God, having no regard for His glory, what pleased and displeased a holy God. He is thus brought to cry out "WHAT MUST I DO TO BE SAVED?"

He now understands truly the awful malignity of sin, as being not only contrary to the whole law of God, but contrary to the true nature of God Himself. He is convinced of the absolute impossibility of contributing anything to obtain his own deliverance. He no longer has any confidence in himself; he has been brought to the end of himself. As Paul wrote "He is without Christ and without hope in this world." (Eph.2)

Thus his mouth is stopped and he confesses himself GUILTY BEFORE GOD, and justly liable to His awful vengeance, both because of the plague of his own heart and his numerous transgressions.

By means of this illumination the renewed soul, under the Holy Spirit through the Word, now perceives (comprehends) how WELL SUITED Christ Jesus is to his poor wretched condition. The only hope he clings to is the prospect of obtaining deliverance from the "wrath to come" through the vicarious life and death of the Lord Jesus (i.e. Jesus Christ lived for and died right in the very place of a people). This keeps his soul from being overwhelmed with grief and from sinking into complete despondency because of the SIGHT of his sins.

As the Holy Spirit (through the Word) presents to him the infinite merits of Christ's obedience and righteousness, His tender compassion for repentant sinners, His great power to save, desires to share in that work now possess his heart. He is now resolved to look for salvation in no other. (person, working, or church) Under the gracious influences of the Holy Spirit, the soul is drawn by such words as these: "Come unto me all ye that labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest." or "Him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out,"and he is led to apply to Him for pardon, cleansing, peace, righteousness, strength.

Other acts besides turning to Christ, such as REPENTANCE, which is a godly sorrow for sin, a hating of sin as sin, and an earnest desire to forsake and be completely delivered from its pollution. In the light of God, the renewed soul now perceives the utter vanity of the world, and the worthlessness of those former worthless toys and perishing trifles which the godless strive so hard to acquire. He has been awakened from the dream-sleep of death, and things are now seen in their true nature. Time is precious, not to be frittered away. God in His awesome Majesty is an object of godly fear and reverence. His holy law is accepted as just and good. All of these perceptions (new sight, or new way of seeing what the Word has stated) and actions are included in that holiness without which no man shall see the Lord. In some these actions are more vigorous than in others, and consequently, are more seen by the man himself. But the fruits of them are visible to others in external acts.

By nature,(the state into which all men are born), the will of man is free in only one direction: AWAY FROM GOD. Sin has enslaved the will, therefore, do we need to be "made free" (John 8:36). The two states are contrasted in Romans 6: "free from righteousness" v20 and "free from sin" v 18, when we have been made alive unto God. At the new birth the will is liberated from the "bondage of corruption" (Rom. 8:21 cf II Peter 2:19), and rendered conformable to the will of God (Psalm 119:97). In our unregenerate state the will was naturally rebellious, and its language was, "Who is the Lord that I should obey Him?" (Exodus 5:2) But the Father promised the Son, "Thy people shall BE WILLING in the day of thy power" (Ps.110:3), and this is accomplished when God "worketh in us both to will and to do of his good pleasure" (Phil 2:13; Heb.13:21)

"A new heart, a new spirit...I will take out your stony heart...and I will put my Spirit within you and cause you to walk in my statutes." (Heb.8:10; Ezek.36:26-27) The regenerated freely consent to and gladly choose to walk in subjection to Christ, being anxious now to obey Him in all things, even though imperfectly. His authority is his only rule, His love the constraining power: "If a man love me, he WILL KEEP my words." (John 14:23)

The will is so emancipated from the power of sin to be enabled to answer the Divine Command.

Rightly does the Lord claim first place as Creator, Owner, and Redeemer. "My son give Me thine heart" (Prov.23:26) expresses God's claim. They "first gave their own selves to the Lord" (II Cor.8:5) is the response of the regenerate. For before they were born anew, by natural birth they are "lovers of their own selves" and "lovers of pleasure more than lovers of God" (II Tim.3:2,4). When a sinner is renewed, his affections are taken off his idols and fixed on his Lord (I Thess. 1:9). Hence it is written "with the HEART man believeth unto righteousness" (Rom.10:10).And hence, also it is written, "If any man LOVE NOT the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be accursed" (I Cor.16:22).

In Deut. 30:6 we read: "And the Lord God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to LOVE the Lord thy God WITH ALL THY HEART." This is the renewing of the heart, severing its love from all illicit objects. None can truly love God supremely till this miracle of grace has been worked in him. Then, and only then, is it that the affections are refined and directed to their proper objects, He who once was despised by the soul, is now the "altogether lovely" One. He who was hated (John 15:18) is now loved above all others. "Whom have I in heaven but Thee? and there is none upon earth that I desire besides Thee." is now their joyous confession.

The love of God is now become the governing principle of their life. (II Cor.5:13) What before was drudgery is now a delight. The approval of His Saviour is now his concern. Gratitude moves his will to glad obedience. Then his heart goes out to members of Christ's family, no matter their nationality, social position, or church connections: "We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren" (I John 3:14).

A tree is known by its fruits. Faith is evidenced by works. The principle of holiness manifests itself in a godly walk. "If ye know that He is righteous, ye know that every one that doeth righteousness is born of Him" (I John 2:29). The deep longing of every child of God is to please his heavenly Father in all things, and though this longing is never fully realized in this life-"NOT as though I had ALREADY attained, either were already perfect" (Phil.3:12)- nevertheless he continues "reaching forth unto those things which are before."

A change will take place in the conduct of the most oral unconverted man as soon as he is born from above. Not only will he be far less eager in his pursuit of the world, more careful in his selections of companions, but he now realizes that the holy eye of God is ever upon him, marking not only his actions, but weighing his motives. He now bears the sacred name of Christ, and his deepest concern is to be kept from everything which would bring a reproach upon it. His aim is to let his light so shine before men that they may see his good works and glorify his Father which is in heaven. That which gives him concern and distress is not the sneers and taunts of the ungodly, but that he fails to measure up to the standard God has set before him, and that conformity to it after which he so yearns. BUT ought not the Christian to "grow in grace"? Yes, indeed. Yet it must be emphatically said that growing in grace most certainly does not mean an increasing satisfaction with myself. No, it is the very opposite. The more I walk in the light of God, the more plainly I see the vileness within me. The only relief from this distressing discovery and the only peace for the renewed heart is to look away from self to Christ and His perfect work for us. Faith empties of all self-complacency and gives an exalted estimate of God in Christ.

A growth in grace is defined, in great part, by the words that immediately follow: "...and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ (II Peter 3:18). It is the GROWING realization of the perfect suitability of Christ to a poor sinner, the deepening conviction of His fitness to be the Saviour of such a vile wretch as the Spirit shows me I am. It is the apprehension of how much I need His precious blood to cleans me, His righteousness to clothe me, His arm to support me, His advocacy to answer me on high, His grace to deliver me from all my enemies, both inward and outward.

The more the heart is occupied with Christ, the more the mind is stayed on Him by trusting in Him (just camped right there, JCS) (Isaiah 26:3), the more will faith, hope, love, patience, meekness, and all spiritual graces be strengthened and drawn forth into exercise and action to the glory of God. The MANIFESTATION of growth in grace and in the knowledge of Christ is another thing. The actual process of growing is not perceptible either in the natural or in the spiritual sphere; but the results of it are, mainly so to others. The chief EVIDENCES of spiritual growth in the Christian are a deepening hatred of sin and a higher value put on spiritual things, a yearning after them, and a fuller recognition of our deep need and dependency on God to supply it.

"The Lord will give grace and glory: no good thing will He withhold from them that walk uprightly" (Ps.84:11). Grace and glory are not to be separated. Grace is glory begun. Glory is grace elevated to its perfection in the eternal state. In I John 3:2, we are told that we shall be like Him, reason? "WE SHALL SEE HIM AS HE IS." The immediate vision of the Lord of glory will be a transforming one, the bright reflections of God's purity and holiness cast upon the glorified will make them perfectly holy and blessed. BUT there is to be a resemblance of that here in the lives of His people. And too comes from BEHOLDING HIM. (II Cor.3:18)

"But we all...beholding...the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord."

RnMomof7: But don't Mormons believe that Adam was a god?

WhiteMountain: No, we don't... Go back and reread my recent discussion with you and Woody.

Well, I don't know exactly what you believe but your LDS organization does have some well-known opinions on the subject that are not compatible with orthodox Christian belief within either the Roman or non-Roman traditions:

"We believe in a God who is Himself progressive, whose majesty is intelligence; whose perfection consists in eternal advancement -- a Being who has attained His exalted state by a path which now His children are permitted to follow, whose glory it is their heritage to share. In spite of the opposition of the sects, in the face of direct charges of blasphemy, the Church proclaims the eternal truth: 'As man is, God once was; as God is, man may be.'" (LDS Apostle James E. Talmage, Articles of Faith, Ch.24, p.430 - p.431, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM)
" 'It is the first principle of the gospel to know for a certainty the character of God,' the inspired word continues, 'and to know that we may converse with Him as one man converses with another, and that He was once a man like us; yea, that God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as Jesus Christ Himself did.' The Father is a glorified, perfected, resurrected, exalted man who worked out his salvation by obedience to the same laws he has given to us so that we may do the same." (LDS Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, A New Witness for the Articles of Faith, p.64, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM)
"Thus, on this beautiful spring morning in the Sacred Grove, Joseph Smith witnessed the renewal of God's dealing with his children in accordance with the great gospel plan of redemption. Upon this occasion God the Father and his Beloved Son Jesus Christ appearing as glorified Resurrected Beings unto a chosen servant of God, made known once again the state of immortality which man will attain in preparation for the next estate of eternity; that also the world once again could know the reality of the personal nature of God the Father and his Beloved Son. (LDS Apostle Alvin R. Dyer, Conference Report, April 1963, p.49 - p.50, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM)
"As we stretch our imaginations to absorb the limitlessness of the creations of God we turn to a favorite song: If you could hie to Kolob in the twinkling of an eye, And then continue onward with that same speed to fly, D'ye think that you could ever, through all eternity, Find out the generation where Gods began to be? Or see the grand beginning, where space did not extend? Or view the last creation where Gods and matter end? Methinks the Spirit whispers, "No man has found 'pure space,'" Nor seen the outside curtains, where nothing has a place. The works of God continue, and worlds and lives abound; Improvement and progression have one eternal round. There is no end to matter; there is no end to space; There is no end to spirit; there is no end to race." (LDS Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, p.250, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM)
"God: Creator And Ruler Of Many Worlds. -- While it is true that evolutionists may be divided between theistic and atheistic groups, yet most of those professing belief in God consider him to be an indefinable force, essence, or power of an incomprehensible nature. According to revelation, however, he is a personal Being, a holy and exalted Man, a glorified, resurrected Personage having a tangible body of flesh and bones, an anthropomorphic Entity, the personal Father of the spirits of all men. (D. & C. 130:22- 23; Moses 6:51, 57; Abra. 3:22-24; Jos. Smith 2:16-19.)"
"We are members of the family of the Eternal Father. He is a glorified and exalted and eternal Being, having a resurrected body of flesh and bones. His name is God, and the kind of life he lives is God's life. His name is also Eternal, and the name of the kind of life he lives is eternal life. Eternal life is God's life, and God's life is eternal life. We are commanded to be perfect as he is perfect and to advance and progress until we become like him, or in other words, until we gain eternal life. Thus Joseph Smith said, "You have got to learn how to be Gods yourselves, and to be kings and priests to God, the same as all Gods have done before you, namely, by going from one small degree to another, and from a small capacity to a great one; from grace to grace from exaltation to exaltation, until you attain to the resurrection of the dead, and are able to dwell in everlasting burnings and to sit in glory, as do those who sit enthroned in everlasting power." (Teachings, pp. 346-47.) Christ our Lord has so obtained, thus enabling him to say to the faithful: "Ye shall be even as I am, and I am even as the Father." (3 Ne. 28:10.)" (LDS Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, The Mortal Messiah, Vol.1, p.23 - p.24, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM)
"I will prove that the world is wrong, by showing what God is. I am going to inquire after God; for I want you all to know Him, and to be familiar with Him; and if I am bringing you to a knowledge of Him, all persecutions against me ought to cease. You will then know that I am His servant; for I speak as one having authority. ... "I will go back to the beginning before the world was, to show what kind of a being God is. What sort of a being was God in the beginning? Open your ears and hear, all ye ends of the earth. for I am going to prove it to you by the Bible, and to tell you the designs of God in relation to the human race, and why He interferes with the affairs of man. ... "God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens! That is the great secret. If the veil were rent today, and the great God who holds this world in its orbit, and who upholds all worlds and all things by His power, was to make himself visible,--I say, if you were to see him today, you would see him like a man in form--like yourselves in all the person, image, and very form as a man; for Adam was created in the very fashion, image and likeness of God, and received instruction from, and walked, talked and conversed with Him, as one man talks and communes with another. ... "In order to understand the subject of the dead, for consolation of those who mourn for the loss of their friends, it is necessary we should understand the character and being of God and how He came to be so; for I am going to tell you how God came to be God. We have imagined and supposed that God was God from all eternity. I will refute that idea, and take away the veil, so that you may see. ... "These are incomprehensible ideas to some, but they are simple. It is the first principle of the gospel to know for a certainty the character of God, and to know that we may converse with Him as one man converses with another, and that He was once a man like us; yea, that God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as Jesus Christ Himself did; and I will show it from the Bible. ... "I wish I was in a suitable place to tell it, and that I had the trump of an archangel, so that I could tell the story in such a manner that persecution would cease forever. What did Jesus say? (Mark it, Elder Rigdon!) The scriptures inform us that Jesus said, as the Father hath power in himself, even so hath the Son power--to do what? Why, what the Father did. The answer is obvious--in a manner to lay down his body and take it up again. Jesus, what are you going to do? To lay down my life as my Father did, and take it up again. Do you believe it? If you do not believe it you do not believe the Bible. The scriptures say it, and I defy all the learning and wisdom and all the combined powers of earth and hell together to refute it. Here, then, is eternal life--to know the only wise and true God; and you have got to learn how to be gods yourselves, and to be kings and priests to God, the same as all gods have done before you, namely, by going from one small degree to another, and from a small capacity to a great one; from grace to grace, from exaltation to exaltation, until you attain to the resurrection of the dead, and are able to dwell in everlasting burnings. and to sit in glory, as do those who sit enthroned in everlasting power. And I want you to know that God, in the last days, while certain individuals are proclaiming His name, is not trifling with you or me." (LDS President Joseph Smith, History of the Church, Vol.6, Ch.14, p.305-6, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM)
"Intelligent beings are organized to become Gods, even the Sons of God, to dwell in the presence of the Gods, and become associated with the highest intelligences that dwell in eternity. We are now in the school, and must practice upon what we receive." (LDS President Brigham Young, Discourses of Brigham Young, p.245, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM)
"This was the calling of Joseph Smith. He taught anew that God was in the form of man; that man was made in the image of God; and he taught the principles of justice, mercy, charity, and forgiveness. ... He taught the truths that the Prophets before him had taught; and he went beyond them. ... Joseph Smith taught men to look up to heaven and conceive of a God in the form of man. He taught them that they could become like their Father and God, who was 'an exalted Man.' And what is more simple and reasonable? Don't you parents expect your children to become like you? Or do you expect your children to be something else than men and women? No. You men will see your sons become men; you women will see your daughters become women. Then God our Father--yes, and our Mother--in heaven, looking down upon this world-- this school house in which their children are being educated--expect, and Joseph Smith taught it as a truth, that their children will be exalted, if they pursue the proper course, until they shall become divine beings themselves, worthy to stand upon that plane where stand their Father and their Mother in heaven. Like begets like; and the principle of eternal progress will make of man a God. (LDS Apostle Orson F. Whitney, Collected Discourses, Vol.5, May 8, 1898, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM)

Look through these statements and tell me exactly which ones you agree with and which ones you disagree with.

Specifically, do you believe the following:

"As man is, God once was; as God is, man may be."

"The Father is a glorified, perfected, resurrected, exalted man who worked out his salvation by obedience to the same laws he has given to us so that we may do the same."

Do you believe that God "is a personal Being, a holy and exalted Man, a glorified, resurrected Personage having a tangible body of flesh and bones, an anthropomorphic Entity, the personal Father of the spirits of all men."?

Do you believe that we have a Mother in Heaven as well as a Father?

It seems to me that you either believe in the teachings of your church or you do not. The LDS notion of universal salvation cannot paper over the vast differences between traditional Christian teachings within either the Roman or non-Roman camps. You try to minimize these differences but in the end, you either are LDS or you are not.

Do you or do you not believe the teachings of the LDS church? Are your Apostles, including Joseph Smith, teaching absolute truth or are they in error and heretics?

These basic issues determine whether a person is a good Catholic, a good Protestant, or a good Mormon by the doctrines of their traditions.

It is possible to be a heretic from Romanism, Protestantism and Mormonism at the same time. I'm asking if you really do absolutely agree and affirm the teachings of the Apostles of your church. Or not. No more wiggling around trying to pretend that we really all believe in the same thing. I say that if you believe in the LDS teachings, you do beliee in a different god than do Catholics and Protestants. The differences between Roman and non-Roman Christians are not even remotely comparable to the differences between the LDS and the two traditional camps of Christendom.

I'm much more interested in what you believe than in how you wish to represent the LDS. The LDS has spoken through Smith and the LDS Apostles. I want to know if you agree and affirm their teachings absolutely. Or do you reject their LDS teachings?

There is no middle ground on these issues and, given your background in the Protestant tradition, it is not possible for you to be ignorant of these differences.

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.