Replies

I posted on Romans 3 earlier today. Did you read it? And, yes, it's the word of God but we understand it differently. It, however, is a theological exposition. The story of God covering Moses with his hand is a story that requires me to decide whether I think it happened the way it says or it didn't happen the way it says. I say it did.

Romans 3 requires a clear acknowledgement that it is the word of God, but it also requires interpretation.

Before even coming to the text we know we're going to disagree on that, because we know that you're a calvinist and I'm not.

Romans 3 requires a clear acknowledgement that it is the word of God, but it also requires interpretation.

Unlike the "hand of God" *grin*

Good night X .Blessed dreams

Your theory, from Wesley, that God has left a remnant of Himself within man after the Fall, is interesting to me because of my own study of the Fall. Please allow me to go over some of the issues, starting with this post.

***

According to the warning given to Adam, man would DIE on the very day he disobeyed God. Inasmuch as physical death did NOT occur on the day of the Edenic crime, the original warning has to have been primarily a warning that man would die SPIRITUALLY on that day.

The Lie of Eden, of course, was that man would NOT die spiritually as God had warned.

Notice that this Creator-hating lie from Satan was a PROSPECTIVE lie. Next, notice that any theological position maintaining that man did not really die spiritually in the Fall is necessarily the very same lie, but offered RETROSPECTIVELY.

I assume you can follow my logic, and I submit that it is staggeringly important. Because it is important, I'll ask you to be sure you see what I am saying. In any case, I would like to summarize my point by saying that to maintain that man did not die spiritually in Eden is a deadly heresy. It is Satanic, not Christian.

Alas, this demonic mess fools people. The Lie of Eden, when you think about it, is actually a counterfeit gospel predating the gospel! Satan said, in effect, "God forgives. Don't worry: be happy. Trust me as the messenger. Obey me by believing me and acting on that belief to seal that belief. If you do, I will give you the wisdom of God. In that wisdom, you will have liberty to enjoy life to the fullest extent for the first time. And you will live forever in bliss."

Brother pastor, I flatly submit that this is the main "gospel" being preached in our day. It sounds like the gospel, but it's not the gospel. And throwing in a few Bible stories and a little doctrine and mentioning Jesus Christ doesn't make it the gospel. It is actually the wide-doorway deception of spurious conversion.

And I submit that most of today's churchgoers have actually gone through the wrong doorway. The reason why they believe they have embraced the gospel is because they are stuck in the Lie of Eden--which does sound like the gospel in their souls. They don't really believe the good news of the Atonement. As it turns out, these fools just don't believe the bad news of the Fall.

In other words, the reason why they believe they are saved is because they aggressively believe the Lie in their souls. They draw nigh unto God with their lips when their heart is still far from Him. They pay lipservice to the Lordship of Christ, but lipservice doesn’t count for anything except the aggravation of their own damnation.

My point is that only a regenerate sinner can confess Christ as Lord from the heart. Nothing else counts. The professing Christians I have been describing are still spiritually DEAD. (And they don't realize this--largely because they are physically alive!)

A spurious conversion, in other words, is just a recapitulation of the Fall. And the Lord Himself tells us that the wide-doorway experience of spurious conversion is actually a lot more common than the True Doorway experience of true conversion.

So, this stuff is amazingly serious for sinners to understand. It is especially important for you as a pastor to understand. It explains all of the tares that you mentioned as a problem within American Methodism. (If born-again Methodist pastors had a better understanding of spurious conversion in the Lie of Eden, they would not permit so many tares to be planted. Unfortunately, the mess has gotten so bad that a lot of Methodist pastors are tares themselves.)

To summarize, then, one of the most important doctrines in Christianity is the doctrine of the Fall. One of the most important sub-doctrines in the doctrine of the Fall is that unregenerate sinners are SPIRITUALLY DEAD. Failure to affirm this loudly and clearly and correctly will trigger the wide-doorway deception of professionistic pseudo-conversion. And in some pastoral ministries, this demonic mess happens over and over and over.

So, please be CAREFUL. We already have too many pastors. We need better pastors, not more pastors.

I will assume that you will agree with what I have said thus far, but I will pause to solicit your comments, if any.