[11th Earl of Mar]

I believe Western ideals put into practice will cause ANY society to succeed, regardless of the skin color of the people who implement them.

If you believe otherwise, please tell us which skin colors are incompatable with Western ideals?

[traditionalist]

I believe Western ideals put into practice will cause ANY society to succeed, regardless of the skin color of the people who implement them.

You're changing the terms of the debate. The question is not whether non-Western societies can "succeed," whatever that means, but whether Western civilization will survive.

Ideals don't create a civilization; people do. If Western people are overwhelmed by other peoples, the civilization that results will simply not be Western because because the people who run it won't be Westerners. It's that simple. The successor civilization might be economically prosperous, like Japan, but Western it will not be.

[rko1933]

SO TRUE