Celebrating 470 years of an ongoing miracle, the apparition of Our Lady of Guadalupe 1531

In the year 1531 in Mexico, the Holy Virgin Mary appeared to Juan Diego, a peasant who was converting to Catholicism. It was the 9th of December, the original feast day of the Immaculate Conception, when Juan Diego was on his way to the Church for instruction and to hear Holy Mass. Juan heard someone calling him "Juanito...Juan Dieguito." Juan Diego looked to the top of Tepeyac Hill and saw a lady of overpowering brillance and beauty, who's garments shone like the sun. She appeared to be about 14 years old.

The Lady introduced herself in these words: "Know for certain, dearest of my sons, that I am the perfect and perpetual Virgin Mary, Mother of the True God, through whom everything lives, the Lord of all things, who is Master of Heaven and Earth. I ardently desire that a temple be built here for me where I will show and offer all my love, my compassion, my help and my protection to the people. I am your merciful Mother, the Mother of all who live united in this land, and of all mankind, of all those who love me, of those who cry to me, of those who have confidence in me. Here I will hear there weeping and sorrows, and will remedy and alleviate their sufferings, necessites and misfortunes." She told Juan Diego to go the Bishop Zumarraga and tell him what he had seen and heard.

Juan Diego bowed reverently and said "My Holy One, my Lady, I will do what you ask of me."

Bishop Zumarraga had been sent by Spain to the New World to convert and instruct the native people. At that time in Mexico human sacrifice to the gods Quetelcoatl and Coatlicue, and various other pagan gods were occuring, as many as 20,000 victims would be sacrificed at the dedication of a temple.

Bishope Zumarraga had not been having much success converting the Aztec and native people and distrust and anger was spreading amongst the two. He had been praying to God for assistance and a sign, the sign was that of roses. Roses would be the sign that Bishop Zumarraga wanted in order to know that he was doing the right thing. But now it was December and roses were not blooming.

Juan Diego arrived and was greeted by the Bishop. The Bishop welcomed him warmly but upon hearing his story dismissed him pleasantly. Juan Diego thought he had failed and after hearing Mass and instruction returned to his home.

Our Lady appeared to him again, asking him if he had had success with the Bishop. Juan told Our Lady that he did not think the Bishop believed him and that perhasps she should send someone of greater importance. Our Lady smiled at Juan Diego, telling him that she had chosen him to be the deliverer of the message and urged him to return to the Bishop the next day and again make the request.

Juan Diego did return the next day and again gave the Bishop the message. Bishop Zumarraga was surprised to see Juan Diego again so soon. He questioned him a bit at length and again dismissed him. Now he wondered if there were something too Juans message. Before dismissing Juan Diego the Bishop told Juan that he needed a sign from the Lady to be convinced. Juan asked the Bishop what kind of sign he would like and he would tell the Lady the Bishops reequest. The Bishop told Juan that he would leave the sign up to the Lady to deliver.

On his way back home Juan Diego again encountered Our Lady. He told her that the Bishop had requested a sign but did not say what the sign should be. Our Lady told Juan: "That is very well,my little son, return here tomorrow and you will have the sign he requested." She also told him that he would be rewarded for all he had done on her behalf.

When Dec. 11th came Juan Diegos uncle, Juan Bernardino, was gravely ill and Juan Diego stayed by his side and did not go to the Bishop. All night he prayed and attended to his uncle until the morning of the 12th when his uncle took a turn for the worse. Juan wanted to get a priest to enable his uncle to recieve the sacraments before he died.

Juan now had a dilemma, if he went past Tepeyac hill he was sure to encounter the Lady. He wanted to get the priest in order to bring him to his uncle before he died but did not want to disappoint Our Lady so he decided to go around the other side of Tepeyac hill. He thought that surely Our Lady would understand.

As Juan Diego tried to duck Our Lady he was suddenly intercepted by her, as she called out to him "What is the matter my little son?" "Where are you going?" Juan explained to the Lady "Noble Lady, it will grieve you to hear what I have to say. My uncle, your poor servant, is very sick. He is suffering from the plague and is dying. I am hurrying to the Church in Mexico City to call a priest to here his confession and give him the last rites. When I have done this, I will return here immediately to convey your message." "Please forgive me and be patient with me. I am not decieving you. I promise to faithfully come here tomorrow with all haste."

There was a pause. Our Lady looked at Juan Diego and uttered the words that have rung down through nearly 5 centuries. "Listen and let it penetrate your heart, my dear little son, do not be troubled or weighed down with grief. Do not fear any illness or vexation, anxiety or pain. Am I not here who am your Mother? Are you not under my shadow and protection? Am I not your fountain of life? Are you not in the folds of my mantle? In the crossing of my arms? Is there anything else you need?" She then assured Juan that his uncle would not die from his illeness and at this very moment was cured.

She told Juan to go to the top of Tepeyac Hill and pick as many flowers as he could carry and bring them down to her. Juan climbed the hill and could not believe the multitude of Castilian Roses blooming on the top. They were blooming out of season. He gathered as many as he could carry and brought them down to Our Lady, who arranged them in his tilma (poncho made of cactus plant fibers. Our Lady arranged them and folded them up in Juans tilma. She told him that this was the sign that the Bishop wanted and to take them to him.

Juan Diego finally got in to see the Bishop with his bundle. The Bishop recieved Juan and Juan told him the following. "Your Excellency, I obeyed your instructions, very early this morning, the celestial Lady told me to come and see you again. I asked for the sign which you requested and which she had promised to give me. She told me to climb to the top of the hill where I had previously seen her, to pick the flowers growing there. I knew quite well that the summit of the hill was no place for flowers to grow, especially this time of year, but I did not doubt her word. When I reached the top, I was astonised to find myself surrounded by beautiful flowers. I plucked as many as I could carry and brought them back to her. She arranged them with her own hands and replaced them in my robe in order that I might bring them to you. Here they are. Behold, recieve them." With that Juan Diego released the ends of his tilma and the flowers, mingled with Castillian Roses, cascaded to the floor in a profusion of colour and perfume.

Zumarraga gazed speechless at the roses, the sign that he had been praying for peace in the country. Full of wonder he lifted his eyes back up to Juan Diego to find that the tilma now had an image of Our Lady appearing on it.

From that day, December 12th 1531, the tilma has survived, miraculously. At that time 8 million Mexicans and Aztec Indians converted to Catholicism. The human sacrifice to the pagan gods ceased.

For nearly 500 years there have been miracles through Our Lady and the tilma. Scientists have studied it, socialist revolutionaries tried to destroy it, there have been volumes written about the tilma, which is very much like the Shroud of Turin.

On this feast day of Our Lady of Guadalupe, which means to the Aztecs "she who crushes the head of the serpent" I would urge you to read the story, say some special prayers to Our Lady, particularly to end the human sacrifice of abortion in this country.

Read John 17 and you will see that that particular title is aimed very pointedly at the Father.

OK. If the Father is the "True God," what does that make Jesus? The "Mostly True God"?

Read John 17 and you will see that that particular title is aimed very pointedly at the Father.

{sigh} There you go, throwing that bible stuff around again. You really should quit trying to play cards while your deck is missing the other 51 cards.</sarcasm>

Look, before I make this last statement I want you to know that I do respect Roman Catholics as true Christians. However, I do not believe that your belief in Mary as perfect can be substantiated by the Bible. One proof text, that may or may not have a certain meaning is not enough. I think that another perfect individual besides Christ would be a big deal. The New Testament authors would have said something about it. I'm not trying to bash your faith, but rather understand. God Bless.

I find it most interesting that the Supreme Court decision which gave the Presidency to George Bush Junior was rendered on the Catholic Feast Day of the Lady of Guadeloupe. I mean, George Bush opposes abortion, and Gore supported it. The Lady of Guadelupe is the Catholic saint of the unborn, Very intersting indeed.

I always keep an open mind.

Why would I try and talk titles to a Catholic. You think the title 'Holy Father' is for the pope.

Nice dodge. You get the undercoating on that one? Five year warranty?

Anyway, if the Father is the "True God," what is Jesus? The "Mostly True God"?

If the Father is the Father, is Jesus the Father?

Pay attention. I'm going to do something you might find useful for later. I am going to answer the question that was put to me. You might want to try it sometime.

The Father is not the Son or the Spirit. The Son is not the Father or the Spirit. The Spirit is not the Father or the Son. And yet they are all God. True God.

You seem to want to make "Godness" or "True Godness" a character of only the Father. Is there a difference between being "God" and being "True God"? If the Father is "True God" is the Son "Mostly True God" or what?

I've asked you three times.

MOG has always had a mother of the Father sound to it to me and this proves it.

You are really into "tone," aren't you. Kindly look at the meaning of the phrase as defined by the Catholic Church rather than depend on your ear, because what you are hearing is dead wrong.

I am a Roman Catholic and we Roman Catholics do not worship Our Blessed Virgin Mary. That beautiful humble servant of God who gave birth to Jesus, the God-Man, is one whom we love with the deepest affection. You can rant and rave and tear apart but the likes of you cannot separate Roman Catholics from the love we have for our wonderful, beautiful, sinless Virgin Mary. "Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee, blessed art thou among women and blessed in the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death. Amen."

Renatus,

Believe me - I have nothing against any Catholic (including you). My family, neighbors, and some of my best friends are Roman Catholic. My issue is with the Catholic church and its inconsistency with Scripture - especially as it relates to the elevation of Mary. I have no idea whether Mary was beautiful or not (I would like to think so), but she certainly was not sinless ("For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God"). Furthermore, why would she have to be sinless to heed the call of God?

I think that another perfect individual besides Christ would be a big deal.

We believe that Mary is the first Christian, and the model for all Christians. Except that we believe that she from the first monent of her existence was preserved from sin as we all shall be after we fall asleep and meet Christ face to face. This has to do with her relationship with Christ rather than her nature, for from the moment of her conception she "knew" him as we will only know him in heaven. Like us, she is a mere creature, and she, like us, can only "know" the Triune God through her son, Jesus. Her radiance is that of the moon as compared with that of Jesus, which is that of the sun, and is but a pale reflection of his.

I can appreciate and understand where you are coming from. I am convinced that RC's do not actually worship Mary (at least you're not supposed to), but the entire Mary theology cannot be backed up by scripture. I personally have serious problems with that. I can accept the word of God as being passed down the year with near flawless accuracy, but I have a hard time accepting church tradition that has been passed down by men. I cannot know with 100% certainty that the RCC is wrong here, and will not make that statement, but I will say that, and I do not think this is being dishonest in any way, that Mariology cannot be shown scripturally to be correct. Some day we will know the truth. God bless.

My answer is that I am only comfortable with biblical titles given to God. When we start making them up ourselves we get ourselves into trouble with things like "Mother of God" or "God the Son". I asked the Father question because for verse that says "And Has name shall be called, Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace" Each one is a particular name and title and each one is significant. It's very Catholic to ascribe significance to the ones you have made up yourself but I won't touch them. I only respect what God calls Himself.

So now that we remember that verse is the Son the Father? Maybe we shouldn't be so dogmatic and just listen more carefully to the Word of God.

Did any of that answer the question I posed thrice to you?

No. Why can't you say Jesus is God?

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