Posted on 11/16/2001 1:21:47 PM PST by The Magical Mischief Tour
It shouldn't be necessary to remind the tinfoil hat conspiracy theorists that this country is at war and that popping off publicly with sinister suspicions that incite suspicion, fear and hatred of our government gives aid and comfort to our enemies.
I was quite happy to believe it was mechanical failure until that bird theory came up. That bird theory was bird brained, and it got shot down in an hour's time. Now, it's air currents? Give me a break! If the government is going to lie to us, it darn well better come up with a good lie, or you PRO-ESTABLISHMENT PEOPLE are the ones with tin foil hats.
The NTSB's job is TO PROVE WHY ITS SAFE TO FLY.
If they need help, the FBI and CIA are there to assist. The real potential of a catastrophic economic collapse due to airliners falling from the sky is a matter of NATIONAL SECURITY.
Truth is always sacrificed in the name of National Security.
That's the answer to this and future airliner 'accidents'.
No, it's not necessary, because it's BS. Suspicion of government is the entire basis of the Constitution. Which agency do you work for, Mr Member since September 26, 2001?
There is nothing sinister about being suspicious of the government. It's the government coverups that led to 9/11 and got us to this point. It is the government who gave aid and comfort to the enemy.
And, to the NTSB - thank you for posting these photos so quickly. I am still hoping (perhaps irrationally) that President Bush will mandate that the truth be told about whatever it is they find caused the crash - no matter the ramifications. As I said constantly during all the many Clinton "events" - the families of the victims of the crash deserve the truth; America can handle the truth! Give it a try!
The rapid posting of the photos of the tail fin part pictures to me is a good start towards indicating that we may actually be moving (ever so slowly perhaps) towards the NTSB not doing a "political" investigation but a truth telling investigation. Quite a change. Hope it continues....again, even if it is ever so slowly happening.
Just asking - any experts here who can explain the blackened surface look at the base of the tail fin shown here? (it looks burnt to me - but am just observing - not any kind of expert .... just asking the question to gain info.) Also, part of the detachment area has the smooth, rounded look - any explanation? Is that how the tailfin looked before its attachment? (looks like it would be a smooth rounded attachment to some part that fits into the rounded area - ??? like a socket??? Again - just asking.
These photos ought to give many clues. And, surely, chemical analysis of the surfaces of the tailfin at the points of separation would give more info. Welcome any informative replies.
You are as wrong as you are new to this forum.
The desire by some to guide, as well as possible, the shaky, stumbling footsteps of Washington in troubled times so that it does not itself (completely) cross the threshold into becoming an enemy of the Constitution is a good thing.
Those with an unquestioning loyalty to any passing regime that SUPERCEDES the Constitution are the ones whose actions are suspect among Patriots.
Keeping the Washington Regime as honest as possible (especially considering its poor track record in this area) is not giving 'aid and comfort' to our enemies.
Citing the prosecution of the (however welcome) pseudo-war du jour as a sort of blanket justification for additional trampling of the Bill of Rights is behavior that would suggest that the speaker of such words might themselves bear some scrutiny, however.
The "Charred" looking - to me a non-expert observer - base at the attachment (detachment) place of the tail fin?
And then there is this photo - Which shows no charred parts at its base but at the forward attachment spot - a charred looking spot.
Again - I am using "charred" because it is blackened. Perhaps this is from being in the salt water. Just asking.
Eyewitnesses are not credible. Repeat after me, "eyewitnesses are not credible". There, that fixes the fire problem.
Pilots are taught this maneuver as part of training. If memory serves, you need about 1000-1500 feet to recover properly. During this, you are feeling about 4G's. That should be nothing for the average commercial pilot. The only problem would be if there was no fin. Without a rudder, it's near impossible to recover from a spiral dive. The only way you lose rudder control, is if you lose the controls (electronics on an A300) or if you have no vertical fin.
The story so far, as far as I know, is that there was minor wake turbulence after takeoff, the fin hit the water shortly after that, one engine fell off shortly after, and then the aircraft hit the ground in Queens. These things are built to withstand minor turbulence, and spiral dives. In my mind, there's two ways this could have happened, mechanical sabotage, or the wake turbulence caused it. Which is quite plausable.
I'll use an example of a Cessna 172 (small aircraft, approximately a 40 foot wingspan) taking off immediately after a Boeing 747. The wingtip vortices coming off the ends of the wings on the 747 are large, think of horizontal tornadoes, spinning in opposite directions. If there's no crosswind, the disturbed air will stay disturbed for a while. If the next aircraft was a 747, it would be fine, as it's wings are built to handle the stresses of taking off in high winds, but our little Cessna, holding short on the taxiway, will get it's wings ripped off after only 3 or 4 seconds in the air. The pilot will experience extreme buffetting before he hits the ground again, possibly belly up.
I know this will bring all you conspiracy theorists down, but wake turbulence could be the answer. If the aircraft taking off ahead of the A300 was larger than it by more than, say 20 feet of wingspan, there would be enough wake turbulence to seal the fate of the flight. In the end, this is a judgement call on behalf of the pilot, as he could've asked for a FOD run to waste time, and allow the vortices to clear.
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