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To: Askel5
I spoke with a conservative national editor tonight about how the War on Terrorism abroad has become the War on the Constitution at home. He gave me the standard response these days about extreme times calling for extreme measures--it was almost word for word what I heard liberal Roger Cossack of CNN saying on a radio interview earlier.

I stated that it will be interesting to see how much of the Patriot Act will survive review by the Supreme Court. He thought about it, and then said alot of it will be thrown out by the the Court.

It's incredible, as an American, to watch as so many of my fellow citizens openly talk of torture and truth serums, sneak and peek, secret trials with secret evidence and other Soviet atrocities as being necessary for the survival of our freedom.

It reminds me of that saying from a few wars ago, "We had to burn the Constitution in order to save it."

107 posted on 11/16/2001 1:13:41 PM PST by kristinn
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To: kristinn
It's incredible, as an American, to watch as so many of my fellow citizens openly talk of torture and truth serums, sneak and peek, secret trials with secret evidence and other Soviet atrocities as being necessary for the survival of our freedom.

But it's truly unsettling to realize how much sense it makes when you think about it.

They've just been extraordinarily successful in utterly destroying our Common Sense, that's all.

Gramsci will be proven correct.

(Would you could come round the corner for a pint and a set by my friend John ... been too long. =)

140 posted on 11/16/2001 1:14:04 PM PST by Askel5
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To: kristinn
It's incredible, as an American, to watch as so many of my fellow citizens openly talk of torture and truth serums, sneak and peek, secret trials with secret evidence and other Soviet atrocities as being necessary for the survival of our freedom.

Let me comment on one thing here -- the "secret trials with secret evidence" comments. We treated the attack on the WTC in 1993 as a crime, not an act of war. We put the terrorists on trial. All sorts of evidence about the structure of the WTC, what forces the building was capable of withstanding, etc. was used as evidence. This very information about the WTC was used by the terrorists in planning their 9/11 attack! Let's not be so stupid as to have another situation like this happen again.

220 posted on 11/16/2001 1:15:04 PM PST by NYCVirago
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