Posted on 11/09/2001 12:18:53 PM PST by Romulus
I don't know if you remember, but we have talked before when I was Sovereign_Citizen_W. And the agreeing or disagreeing is really not the point. I don't know how much you remember from Catholic school (I hope I remember right), but I am paraphrasing the Word of God:
1 Corinthians 15:12Now if Christ is preached that He has been raised from the dead, how do some among you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? 13But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ is not risen. 14And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is empty and your faith is also empty. 15Yes, and we are found false witnesses of God, because we have testified of God that He raised up Christ, whom He did not raise up--if in fact the dead do not rise. 16For if the dead do not rise, then Christ is not risen. 17And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins! 18Then also those who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished. 19If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men the most pitiable.My joy and desire is to have heavenly treasures. The way that the Bible teaches me to do this does not maximize earthly pleasure. Therefore, if my labor is in vain I should be more pitied than all men!1 Corinthians 15:29 Otherwise, what will they do who are baptized for the dead, if the dead do not rise at all? Why then are they baptized for the dead? 30And why do we stand in jeopardy every hour? 31I affirm, by the boasting in you which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily. 32If, in the manner of men, I have fought with beasts at Ephesus, what advantage is it to me? If the dead do not rise, "Let us eat and drink, for tomorrow we die!"
This is not what I meant! Either the Bible is right, or it is wrong. If it is right, then you are in trouble. If it is wrong, then you should relax and enjoy what is left of your life.
But living your life one way and hoping that you are wrong is like trying to "hedge" your bet. Th And I would be dismayed if you did not look at evidence. If you are willing, I have a little evidence.
Living my life one way? I try to do my best in this world. I make mistakes (BIG ONES AT TIMES). I certainly am not perfect (far far from it). Do I try and help people and be kind whenever I can? Absolutely. Do I wonder if I am doing the right thing or question what I believe in? Every single day. If thee is a God, he made me this way. Whay should I be condemmed for ever for questioning and seeking and wondering at this marvelous universe we live in.
You may not be far from the Lord after all.
One thing I have desired of the LORD, That will I seek: That I may dwell in the house of the LORD All the days of my life, To behold the beauty of the LORD, And to inquire in His temple. To what end shall I feel awe and wonder before Thy beauty? The experience is enough and I shall be satisfied in it.
That does answer the question, even if you don't really understand.
When I accepted Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior, I became a new creature, and turned away from the old. And I will always be saved for all eternity. That does not mean I am now perfect, the means that I am now forgiven for everything I have done, will do, now or in the future. It is the blood of Christ which is my assurance.
Furthermore, Christianity is NOT a religion, IT IS A RELATIONSHIP WITH CHRIST!
You may flush your beliefs, but I will not flush mine.
Praise God for His Son in whom He was well pleased, and in whom I put my trust!
And that is the difference between me and Satan.
Christ died for me, personally, and His blood now covers all of my sins, therefore, I now belong to Him.
And good people go to hell every single day. We are not saved by works or good deeds, we are saved by faith.
Satan is not Omniscient, Omnipotent, or Omnipresent. GOD IS all of that but especially LOVE. Love is committment, not some touchy feeling mumbo jumbo.
Christianity is a relationship and a committment to Christ through faith.
Works come after faith, and are seen as fruit of the Spirit. While born again Christians can and do sin, they are still, nonetheless, SAVED by GRACE and that is FOREVER.
Yeah, but look at the upside; when that time comes, you won't be aware that your selfawareness is no longer operative!
But I think somebody once put it much more succinctly:
"Cogito, ergo sum."
No "cogito", no "sum."
That's Pascal's wager. Old stuff. There is a flip side to your proposition. If you are wrong, you have spent most of your brief lifespan obsessed with mythology and fiction, chanting slogans, sitting through misguided rituals, and worrying about a non-existent afterlife. Which seems to be a terrible waste of this life.
They'd better hurry, the fight's almost over in Afghanistan.
Call the new existence what you like, but it will be different than our current temporal existence. I agree that we will have some recognizable form just as Jesus had a form after resurrection. By "spirit" I do not mean a shifting mass of ectoplasm. Our existence after death will not be with these exact same bodies either. I currently cannot walk through walls, at least not effortly. Many die of unusual circumstances that destroy the body. All things considered, this is a minor point of contention.
As to why God bothered to create the universe, Isn't the underlying question why He didn't just create man in his eternal state? Better yet, why didn't He create man as gods right away? The question is related to the If-God-wanted-us-to-fly-He-would-have-given-us-wings statement. Since Hell is conveniently removed from Mormon theology, how can they be expected to comprehend reward or punishment from our trial here on earth?
The over 3 million near death experiences, about 15% of which are trips to Hell.
The Bible does address this point: If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men the most pitiable. If the dead do not rise, "Let us eat and drink, for tomorrow we die!"
Nevertheless, I have already seen my future!
Nice dance, Woody.
What do you think happened during those 40 days? Why is the Bible silent as to what occurred then?
Based on what you have stated (if I understand it correctly), I pretty much have nothing to worry about as far as my salvation goes. If I'm one of the elect, there's nothing I can do about it, I'm going to be saved at the last day because I'm one of the elect. If I'm not one of the elect, there's still no point in worrying about it, because there is no action that I can take that will change that already-decided-upon result. My free will (if I have any such thing) doesn't affect the outcome.
Welcome to the Church of Que Sera, Sera.
The one thing I don't understand is this: if there's already a final version of the list containing the names of the people who get let in to the Big Celestial Harp Band and Throne Dancing Brigade, and who don't, why do we even need a historical record of the teachings and resurrection of the Savior? It would seem that it would be important for me to know about it if my knowing about it would cause me to take actions that might change the outcome, but you've already told me that my actions don't matter one way or the other. If I'm one of the good guys, I'll be drawn onto the correct path; if I'm not, no amount of trying to get on the path will do any good.
So, what's the point of worrying about it one way or the other?
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