ROME-MOSCOW WATCH -The Secret of Fatima: More to Come?

Inside the Vatican ^ | 26 October 2001 | Inside the Vatican Staff

[Fred Mertz]

My, my, aren't you the open-minded one tonight.

[Theresa]

Father Grunner is mentally unbalanced. He is a classic example of a conspiracy theorist. He sees himself as the last lonely crusader for the preservation of the true church. He has gone beyond extreme with his fixation on the Fatima letter. The Fatima Letter is WAY down on the list of Catholic priorites.

Then there is Cardinal Ratzinger. He is the pope's right hand man. There simply could not be a more stable, wise and trustworthy Catholic leader. When he says something you can trust it. So whatever Grunner says should be tested against what Ratzinger says and Ratzinger should be heeded not Grunner.

[MWS]

patent, I guess when I've asked you to pray for me I must unwittingly have been worshipping you -- or so some would have us believe.

Or, better yet, when you prayed to Patent asking him to pray for you... considering that the definition of "to pray" is "to entreat; to implore"... ;)

[Zipporah]

"She told me she is very worried about the international situation," Don Bianchi told Italian journalist David Murgia. "She said we have entered a crucial time for the Church and for the world -- and that the only salvation is prayer."

Wow.. hey I must be a visionary too.. I KNOW we are in a crucial time for the world.. geez.. who'd have know?

[Hank Kerchief]

I said, "Acutally, holiness, in people, is a matter of the heart and is quite invisible..."

You siad, "When Peter spoke of 'the Holy One and the Just' [Acts 3:14], had Peter not already seen Jesus in person?"

Yes. But what is your point? Are you implying that Peter saw Jesus' Holiness? Nothing like that is stated anywhere. Jesus is the Holy One and Just, and that is Who Peter saw. Nothing more.

Hank

[aposiopetic]

I pray thee, desist from thine efforts to reason with these benighted souls!

Oops, there I go again . . . .

[hsszionist]

The use of the letter to the Ekklasia at Corinth chastising them for not rebuking a man for violating a statute of Torah is enlightening. This specific statute was part of the instructions given by YHVH that most christian churches believe was done away with. This is one of many chapters in the apostolic writings which refute that error.

[aposiopetic]

Hank Kerchief, your post to which I was replying was itself a reply to Arthur McGowan's expression

witness manifest holiness with one's own eyes.

That Peter spoke of the Holy One and the Just, Whom Peter had seen, is entirely consistent with the notion that Peter had witnessed [Jesus'] manifest holiness with his own eyes.

[Hank Kerchief]

That Peter spoke of the Holy One and the Just, Whom Peter had seen, is entirely consistent with the notion that Peter had witnessed [Jesus'] manifest holiness with his own eyes.

I see. Then you can tell me what holiness looks like. Please do.

Hank

[aposiopetic]

Then you can tell me what holiness looks like. Please do.

I don't have to.

Peter saw Jesus. Peter later called Jesus the Holy One. From this I conclude that Jesus' holiness was manifest [recall that Arthur McGowan's term was manifest holiness] to Peter. Certainly Jesus' holiness was not hidden from Peter, nor was Peter indifferent to or unaware of Jesus' holiness.

You remain free to reach a different conclusion, though I really can't understand why you would do so.

If you wish to continue this discussion, please FReepmail me. I may well have erred by diverting the thread. If so, I ask the forgiveness of all.

[George W. Bush]

I see. Then you can tell me what holiness looks like. Please do.

I suspect that the description of holiness will end up sounding like a description of those graven images in your local church of Rome. You know, the ones they don't worship.

[ventana]

Amen to your idea livius. What do we profit engaging those who seek to distract us. We are better put to work explaining, and exclaming those things we know. V's wife.

[ventana]

Fred Mertz has a brain large as it needs to be. And thus it is quite large. V's wife.

[patent]

As far as the Third Secret is concerned I think Mother Angelica said it well when she observed that the Third Secret was being revealed appropriately. From the way she said it one could take her to mean that the Third Secret had been faithfully revealed -- and yet there could be more to it.

A good way to say it, I think. I often think that all of revelation is similarly being revealed in each of our lives. God’s power is awesome and universal.

Clearly since 9/11 we should pray for many, many things not least of which is praying for the Pope's health, safety, and life. I also pray for a breakthrough so he may travel very soon to Moscow.

Amen.

Let's not forget that the Catholic Church continues to exist in north Africa though besieged and oppressed. Among the faithful from Egypt through Libya and into Algeria are some of the bravest Christians you could ever meet. Not one of them will let anything happen to our Pope if they can do something to stop it.

Amazing people, that they can survive in their environment is incomparable. It is humbling to think that I wouldn’t have done remotely as well.

patent  +AMDG

[patent]

patent, I guess when I've asked you to pray for me I must unwittingly have been worshipping you -- or so some would have us believe.

My bad.

It’s OK, so many people “worship” me I just get used to it. The trick is to not let it go to your head. < /sarcasm >

patent  +AMDG

[father_elijah]

I never cease to be encouraged when the sceptics, nay-sayers, and "the opposition" show up. They go right to the top of my prayer list.

And when non-Catholic Christians show up to bash, stab, or challenge, as the case may be, I pray for them to find the Neverending thread where their posts are welcomed and encouraged.

[patent]

No Catholic worships Mary"

A CATHOLIC WORSHIPING MARY

Your link only shows a Catholic praying to Mary, and I will quite clearly state that most Catholics do pray to her. The part of the link that states:

They sin by praying to her and then sin again by lying and saying that they don't.

Is a blatant out and out lie. Catholics clearly and readily state that they pray to her, so the claim that we lie and say we don’t, is just that, a lie. The only Catholics I have ever heard claim they don’t pray to Mary and other saints are the CINOs, Catholics in name only who are barely, if at all, Catholic. Don’t spread lies about us.

As to praying to Mary, it is not worship. That is what I said, we do not worship her. There is a difference between a prayer to God, asking that he forgive our sins, etc. and a request to Mary that she pray for us as well. It is no different from asking any other living individual to pray for us to our Lord, as Mary is quite clearly living.

patent  +AMDG

[Fred Mertz]

Thank you, Padre & V's wife. I try to do the same.