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MT 27: 52-53 tombs were opened, and the bodies of many saints who had fallen asleep were raised. And coming forth from their tombs after his resurrection, they entered the holy city and appeared to many.

What happened to these saints? Did God just put them back in the tomb to wait for the second coming? Or are they in Heaven but other saints are waiting in the tomb for the second coming?

Romans 8: 35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? Romans 8: 38-39 For I am sure that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor poweres, nor height, nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Now, I know that these verses mean something different to you than they do to me but I believe that all the Saints who have died before us are already in Heaven and so when I ask Mary to pray for me she is very present in the spirit world. She is near her Father, her Son, her God and she is near me. This also tells me that I will not be separated from God whether I am alive or dead and my soul will not be separated from God no matter the circumstances. And if I, a lowly, sinning, mere human will not be separated from God through Jesus then how can I doubt that someone as holy and blessed as Mary could possibly be separated from God, then, now or ever.

Now, because I'm not in a very good mood tonight I'm going to say more than I should and then I'm going to run again.

Never mind.

As far as Mary being physically in the room, no she’s not but I’d sure like to know your reasoning for that assinine remark. If I am not separated from God and she’s not separated from God and no believers in Christ are separated from God then I am with God at all times and also with Mary and the Saints.

Someone has to be in a room with me? Some of your arguments are soooooo ridiculous! <

If I am not separated from God and she’s not separated from God and no believers in Christ are separated from God then I am with God at all times and also with Mary and the Saints.

The part us Proddies don't understand is that if you're in a room with God (metaphor-cly speekeeng), why do you talk to Mary to get her to say something to God. If we're not separated at all from God (which you correctly adduce from the Romans passage), then we can pray with confidence to God.

What exactly are you saying that those verses prove? One talks about death not seperating us from the love of God. I doesn't say death doesn't seperate us (the living) from those who have died. This has nothing to do with praying to the dead. The other verse speaks of some who were temporarily raised up. OK if God brings them back to life physically it's OK to talk to them, but that has nothing to do with praying to the dead either. I really don't see how these prove your case at all. Is the best you can do for Scriptures to support this ridiculous practice? Where are the verses that tell us to pray to the dead? Where are the verses that tell us to pray to Mary? Oh that's right, there aren't any. But there are many that tell us to pray to God.

Re 3216

I have made the statement that she is not, as the implication of your statements would infer, the creator of God. And I stated that whether you intend to state her as the creator of God or not. I'm not letting such a blasphemous inferrance hang out there in the wind for others to abuse. If you have a problem with that, tough!

Well then. You seem to be reserving the right to protest against formulations of doctrine which could be easily misunderstood by the ignorant. I'm glad you feel that way.

I'm sure you are also against such simplistic formulations as "We are saved by faith alone," as the "blasphemous inference" from that statement is that we need only profess a belief and need not actually make any changes in our lives. Just believe.