Posted on 02/05/2004 11:24:12 AM PST by george wythe
The city of Miami made a quick $1,000 when it arrested 79-year-old Sidney Wellman on a charge of propositioning a prostitute on Biscayne Boulevard four years ago.
That fine -- paid by Wellman to retrieve a confiscated car -- may soon prove costly to the city.
The Third Circuit Court of Appeal on Wednesday upheld a lower court's ruling that a 1997 Miami ordinance allowing police officers to confiscate vehicles of drivers committing crimes -- particularly buying drugs or soliciting prostitutes -- is invalid.
Circuit Court Judge Celeste Muir ruled in 2001 that the city could not impound a vehicle unless the driver is the sole owner.
Under the city law, drivers had to pay $1,000 in civil penalties to get their vehicles back. Those who couldn't come up with the money lost their vehicles, and the city eventually profited through their sale.
In a 16-page order, the appeals court agreed with the circuit court that in order for the city to confiscate the vehicle, the person driving the car must own it.
Between 1997 and 2001, more than 10,500 vehicles were impounded, and Miami collected almost $8.7 million. Wellman, who proved that the car was owned by his wife, paid the fine to retrieve the vehicle, then sued. He was never convicted of a crime.
Miami could petition for a rehearing or appeal. City Attorney Alejandro Vilarello could not be reached for comment on Wednesday.
Must've been an SUV. :^)
Florida’s Municipal Home Rule Powers Act states that cities may not legislate in an area expressly preempted by state legislation.
Interesting side note: The City of Miami pulled the exact same stunt with a gun "safe storage law". The City officials abviously know about the MHRPA, but simply don't care. They were slapped down on that one, and again here.
You mean, like these fellows?
A Miami police officer has been arrested and accused of pocketing money found during a drug raid.Officer Raynard Gilbert is charged with grand theft and tampering with evidence after an internal affairs investigation found that he stole $700 during a May drug bust.
Gilbert has been a Miami cop for 15 years and he's not the only officer in trouble with the law.
Officer Angel Rodriguez was let go from the force after he allegedly tried to solicit sex from a prisoner he picked up on a traffic stop. Rodriguez was fired but not arrested.
You are wrong. It will simply be another victimless crime that will be rarely prosecuted because there is no longer profit in it for the city. These confiscations were a profit center for the city. Once it starts costing them money, you'll find them to be a lot less enthusiastic in their enforcement.
No. The law never applies to the overlords. Only peasants need worry about laws.
But a few years from now you'll be bitching and moaning about how the courts are all clogged up with these obvious open and shut cases and why can't the cops just issue some kind of civil penalty and why must this kind of thing go on one's record, and waaa waaa waaa.
You'll never be happy.
The prosecutor can charge you or not, entirely independent of whether your car is seized. And even if you're acquitted, that's no guarantee of getting your property back.
As I'm sure you've read here, the 'legal' (and I use the term loosly) basis of this confiscation is the car itself is an accessory to the crime. (bad car!), therefore you have no 5th Amendment right to due process for your property. Any comments on that?
Toss a cigarette butt out a window and lose your car?
So this upsets you? What about people being arrested, having their freedom taken away, and being thrown in jail until a trial is scheduled? Isn't that worse? Happens all the time.
The car was part of the crime -- if the guy were walking down the street and solicited a prostitute he wouldn't have his car seized. And that's another thing. The car is held, pending disposition of the case. The state of Florida doesn't take possession without due process. Ease up.
But you don't want this to be a civil matter anymore. Well, looks like you'll get your wish. Now the guy will have to go through a hassle, get a lawyer, go to court, pay a fine (and I hope to God it's at least $1000.), pay court costs, and now it goes on his record. Oh goody.
You robertpaulsen keep repeating an incorrect description of the Miami ordinance.
The paying of the $1000 impounding fee (and towing fee and storage fee) does not free the court system from dealing with the prostitution charge.
The accused person still has to go to court whether he was using a car or just walking down street when he was arrested by the police.
Repeating a lie 1000 times does not make it true.
Yes. The Constitution says due process must be had before anyone can be deprived of property. Yet probable cause, a much lower standard absent the trial or conviction necessary for due process is used instead. Even worse is the mindset that the plain meaning of the Constitution can be ignored. That didn't begin or end with forfeiture cases.
What about people being arrested, having their freedom taken away, and being thrown in jail until a trial is scheduled?
Amendment VI: "In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial..."
Amendment VIII: "Excessive bail shall not be required..."
If someone is arrested and cannot make bail because the bail amount is excessive, and they are not given a speedy trial, then yes it is an outrage. That's why it was included in the Bill of Rights. Read it sometime. I'm opposed to every single thing it protects us against.
Isn't that worse? Happens all the time.
Yes, it's worse. Two wrongs don't make a right. It should be apparent I'm opposed to all constitutional violations.
The car was part of the crime
I see. It has a will of its own. Rob, a car is property. It's amazing I have to explain that to anyone. And the 5th Amendment says it cannot be taken without due process. Case closed!
if the guy were walking down the street and solicited a prostitute he wouldn't have his car seized
Exactly how do we know what he did? There has been no trial, so there is no evidence presented and no conviction. And he is innocent until proven guilty. Without due process all we have is the word of a man whose employer stands to make $1000 off taking the car. This obvious conflict of interest screams for a third party's oversight. And low and behold we have these things called "courts" for just such a thing.
The car is held, pending disposition of the case. The state of Florida doesn't take possession without due process.
More legalese. Here's a fact: If you have to pay $1000 for a car, it isn't really yours. The police own seized vehicles by every definition of the term. Weaselry and Clintonian euphamisms don't change that one bit.
You would also think being quilty of a real crime might be a requirement....
How about guilty of any crime at all?
BS with cop worship gotta stop....
Having seen that "show", I think it'd be better named PIGS.
Post #33:
Now the guy will be arrested for soliciting prostitution, he goes to jail, makes bail. He has to go to court (tying up the judge, the courtroom, the prosector, the cop, etc.), and upon conviction, he pays a fine, court costs, it goes on his record.
And in the post to which this one replies you write:
Now the guy will have to go through a hassle, get a lawyer, go to court, and if convicted, pay a fine (and I hope to God it's at least $1000.), pay court costs, and now it goes on his record.
It would seem that innocent until proven guilty isn't something you're familiar with.
Or maybe you are intentionally neglecting it.
Or is it just that those with whom you disagree, mein Fuhrer, should have their property taken away?
This involves prostitution, not some SEC violation -- I just stuck my neck way out and assumed the guys would be found guilty in a court of law.
And what percentage of prostitution cases do you think end up with the john being found not guilty. Maybe 1%?
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