The FReeper Foxhole's TreadHead Tuesday - French Tanks in World War II - Dec. 28th, 2003

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[SAMWolf]

Lord,

Keep our Troops forever in Your care

Give them victory over the enemy...

Grant them a safe and swift return...

Bless those who mourn the lost.
.

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French Tanks in World War II

1935 was the decisive moment for the French armored force. That year, most of the tanks that were used during the Campaign of 1940 were introduced and accepted. The characteristics of those machines reflected the French military doctrine of the time. The tank operated as a support for the infantry. Protection was thus the primary concern, crossing abilities came second. Interest for mobility was nowhere to be found: the speed was low, the range laughable. The number of crew members was insufficient, most tanks were devoid of radio. The same year in Germany, Guderian created the first panzerdivisions.

In May 1940 globally, the allies had more tanks (3400) than the Germans (2800).

At the decisive place and moment, at Sedan on May 13th, the Germans had 1500 tanks available vs. the allies, ... zero ! By scattering their tanks all over the frontline, the French had paved the way for their own defeat.



The doctrine was to blame, the choice of materials that resulted made any U-turn impossible. The emblem of the French tanks, the heavy and invulnerable tanks B, hardly fought. Short on fuel, scattered on their way by mechanical breakdowns, delayed by time-consuming maintenance, they were in no position to react quickly enough to the German Blitzkrieg and just fell into the hands of the attackers.



There was no coherent system for naming the French tanks of the time. The digits within the name usually pointed to the year of introduction of a tank. The R-35, H-35, AMR-35, AMC-35 and S-35 were all adopted in 1935. The same applies for the FT-17, adopted in 1917. The first letter usually refers to the builder of the machine: R for Renault, H for Hotchkiss, S for Somua. Those two rules are full of exceptions: FT means "Faible Tonnage" (not too heavy) and is no indication of the producer. The B1 was not introduced in 1901 (nor in 2001). AMC means "automitrailleuse de combat" (combat armored car), AMR means "automitrailleuse de reconnaissance (reconnaissance armored car),

Some figures



Between 1935 and June 1940, the French had built 3500 tanks. They had thus no industrial handicap towards Germany. The most built tank was the R-35, with 1600 units. Some of them were exported. The French tanks were on average heavier than their German counterparts, reflecting the preoccupation for protection.

The Tanks



France ended World War I with thousands of FT-17, the best tank of the time, the first to have a fully revolving turret. This tank and its immediate follower, the FT-18, remained in service until 1940. The first light tank to replace them was the R-35, some 15 years later. It was an infantry tank, well armored but slow and unable to act by itself. Its short gun could not do anything against another tank. It remained standard until the catastrophe of 1940. Hundred or so of diesel-engined but costly FCM-36 completed the battle array of the French infantry.

The cavalry used a another line of tanks, the Hotchkiss. Their mission was reconnaissance and covering. So they had to have a better mobility (speed and range). Those qualities were lacking in the H-35, but its follower, the H-39 was more to the point. Rearmed with a longer 3.7 cm gun, it was even in a position to face enemy tanks. Regrouped in DLC (light cavalry division), those tanks were forced to operate at the pace of a horse, since mechanized and traditional cavalry were mixed in DLC. The first medium tanks after World War I appeared in the early thirties.



The infantry tank D-1 had serious design flaws and was quickly superseded by the D-2, of the same design but with the most glaring flaws corrected. Both paled when appeared the Somua S-35. It was a tank for the cavalry, fast, well-armed, well-protected. Its only but serious failing was the mono-seated turret. This tank was the core of the tanks battalions of the DLM (light mechanical divisions), what the French made the closest to the German panzerdivisions. Their tasks were mere covering and reconnaissance. Breakthrough or real combat were not their mission. They were scattered in Belgium and could not disentangle themselves to intervene on the decisive spot when it was needed. They disappeared in the debacle leading to Dunkirk, loosing all their materials.



The French tradition of heavy tanks dated back to 1918. In that year were built the first 2C, monstrous 'breakthrough' tanks, weighting 68 tons. It took three years before they could enter in service and six units still remained in 1940. Lacking mobility, they were immobilized during rail journeys by the German Luftwaffe and sabotaged. In the thirties, a new generation of heavy tanks entered in service, the B tanks (B1, B1 Bis, B1 ter). Their role was to support infantry, even on the roughest of grounds. They were not at all designed to operate independantly. From 1940 onwards, they made up the core of the DCR (breakthrough armored divisions). When the battle started in earnest, the DCR proved too slow and poorly articulated to react quickly and efficiently. They could not operate on a coordinated way to stem the German flow. After a few hours of combat, they were scattered.

The mechanization plan of the cavalry, introduced in the early thirties, planned the use of tracked armored cars for reconnaissance missions. The AMR-33 and AMR-35 were light and fast vehicles, well-suited for their main mission, but their armament, only one MG, was insufficient to engage combat. The AMC-35, a bit heavier and better armed, remained a reconnaissance vehicle.

Epilogue

After the defeat of June 1940, the Germans took over hundreds of French tanks. They reused them either for occupation duties, or to fight partisans (especially in Yugoslavia), or they converted them (tractors, self-propelled guns, ...) and use them on the Eastern Front.



With the fortune reversal, some French tanks fought again on the allied side. The first ones in Tunisia with the rallied French troops there. Tito's partisans captured some of them and put them into service against the Germans. During the fighting for the liberation of Paris, some ex-French tanks stationed there fell in the hands of the "Resistance". The last French tanks to see active service were Israeli. They took over a dozen H-39 before their first war against the Arabs and retained them in active service until 1956.

The French had their revenge of June 1940 when their army was rearmed with Panther tanks, fallen in the hands of the allies after the German capitulation in 1945.

[SAMWolf]

R-35



With 850 units engaged, the R-35 was the most numerous tank on the allied side in May 1940. It had all the qualities and the failings of the French tanks of the time. Designed as an Infantry tank, it was too slow and its gun was useless against other tanks. Its autonomy was laughable and its one-seat turret overworked the tank commander. On the other hand, its armor was superior to anything the German tanks could put up.

After the cease-fire in June 1940, the R-35 continued to (try to) defend the French colonies overseas (Syria, North Africa). The Germans used them in Russia in accessory roles. The Italians got some of them, which fought in Sicily in 1943. Before the defeat in 1940, several hundreds of those tanks were exported to Poland, Rumania, Yugoslavia and Turkey. Identification: Very similar to the Hotchkiss tanks (H-35 and H-39)with which it shared the turret. The pilot's hatch is on the left of the front hull while the running gear is not symetrical: the fore bogie differs from the two others. The idler is trailing. There is a big central spring on the two rear bogies.

R-35/45

The Roumanians had bought the French R-35 before the war and received most of the Polish units in September 1939. To use it against the Russians, it was necessary to increase the firepower. A prototype, demonstrated in February 1943, mounted a 45 mm gun on the hull of the French machine. About thirty were built before Rumania switched sides.

4.7cm on Tank R-35



One of the first adaptation by the Germans of a captured antitank gun (the excellent Czech 47 mm already used on the Panzerjäger I)on the hull of a captured tank (the less than average French R-35). The were employed by the occupation troops in the West and fought in Normandy.

R-40



Late production model of the R-35, rearmed with a longer 3.7 cm gun. A new running gear greatly improved the cross-country performance of the original model.

Identification: Similar to the R-35, but with a longer gun in the turret and a different running gear, with protective armor side plates.

AMX-38



Project to replace the infantry tanks (R-35, R-40), based on the design of the R-40. It brought a big improvement on both weaknesses of its predecessors: mobility and armament. The prototype was proposed in 1940 and approved even before testing. The production, scheduled for 1941, could not start after the defeat.

H-35



While the infantry chose the R-35, the cavalry had to make do with the rejected H-35. It was faster than its colleague in the infantry and better suited for the reconnaissance and covering missions.

Having the same turret as the R-35, it suffered under the same handicaps: only one seat in it and a short 3.7 cm gun useless against other tanks. The Germans captured lots of those tanks and put them in service on the Eastern Front in the rear area, among other as turretless tractors.

Identification: The H35 differs from the R-35 by its running gear (the three bogies are similar and do not have a visible central spring) and the pilot's hatch is on the right of the hull. Compared to the H-39, the H-35 has a rear hull sloped to the ground. Some H-35 will be rearmed with the same longer 3.7 cm gun as the H-39.

H-39



Improvement of the cavalry tank H-35. The engine is more powerful and the armor reinforced. With a greater speed and a better autonomy, this tank is in a better position to fulfill the covering and reconnaissance missions devolved to the cavalry.

Despite its qualities, it can not avoid the defeat in 1940. It continued its career in the Wehrmacht in secondary missions. One captured H-39 was the first tank of Tito's partisans. Just after the war, Israelis got hold of a dozen units, the first model they had in numbers, and used them until 1956.

Identification: The rear hull, sloped on the H-35 is almost flat on the H-39. Many H-39 were rearmed with a longer 3.7 cm gun.

Marder I on Tank H-39



75 mm antitank gun installed on the chassis of a French tank H-39, captured during the Campaign in the West in May of 1940.

Identification: Running gear of the original H-39 with a large hexagonal combat compartment wider than the hull. Similar to the Marder I on Lorraine tractor, but the combat compartment takes the whole length of the hull.

FCM-36



Competitor of the R-35 as infantry tank, it was rejected because of its prohibitive cost. Only hundred units or so were built. It is the first and almost the only French tank equipped with a diesel engine.

Engaged in 1940, some units were captured and then reused by the Germans.

Identification: The sloped side plates and the all-welded construction differentiate the FCM-36 from all other French tanks. Its turret was installed as a test on the hull of other tanks.

Built by Forges et Chantiers de la Méditerrannée

[SAMWolf]

While most nations had tracked light tanks and wheeled armored cars, the French introduced a special category, the "automitrailleuses" ("machine-gun cars") with the weight and the armament of an armored car but with tracks. The plan to mechanize the cavalry, proposed in 1931 envisaged three types of vehicles (which were all three built):

• The classical wheeled armored cars (AMD for "automitrailleuse de découverte", "discovery machinegun car")
• The AMR ("automitrailleuse de reconnaissance"), a light tracked machine, fast and mobile even off-road but to light to engage combat.
• The AMC ("automitrailleuse de combat") a slightly more powerful machine than the AMR and able to engage combat

Some of those vehicles were engaged in the Ardennes where they faced the German panzerdivisions and were quickly wiped out. The machine was successful as a reconnaissance vehicle, but it was by no mean up to a real fight: any cannon could pierce its armor.

AMR-33



The AMR-33 proved well-adapted to its reconnaissance role thanks to its outstanding cross-country abilities. It was widely used until 1940 but its main weakness was the insufficient armament.

Identification: The running gear differentiate this model from the next one, the AMR-35. There are spokes in the road-wheels while the bogies have a different shape.

AMR-35



The AMR-35 superseded the AMR-33. Although a little smaller, the finishing up was better. Its main armament varied from the light MG, to a heavy one and some units even had a 2.5 cm gun.

Identification: The running gear are differs clearly between the AMR -35 and its predecessor, the AMR-33. The road-wheels are full-disced and the shape of the bogies is different.

AMC-34



Version with a thicker armor of the AMR-33. It was designed to become the standard tank for the cavalry but it was not technically successful and was quickly replaced by the AMC-35.

AMC-35



Also called ACG-1. This light tank was designed to mechanize the French cavalry. It followed the quite unsatisfactory AMC-34. The original armament was sometimes exchanged for an antitank 2.5 cm gun.

Rejected in favor of the Somua S-35 despite its better two-seated turret, only 17 units were bought by the French army. Twelve units were bought by Belgium and rearmed as the "autoblindée du corps de cavalerie" (ABCC).

Identification: Bears some ressemblance with the R-35, having a similar running gear except that the idler is not trailing. The superstructure and and the turret is more boxy and riveted.

Autoblindée du Corps de Cavalerie



Belgian acquisition of the French AMC-35. The vehicle was rearmed in Belgium with the fearsome 47mm antitank gun. 12 vehicule of this kind were in service in May of 1940. Poorly organised in combat, they were quickly lost.

Additional Sources:

www.fronta.cz
mailer.fsu.edu
www103.sakura.ne.jp

[SAMWolf]

D-1



The infantry tank D-1 was the first French tank with a 4.7 cm gun. The weakness of its engine and the numerous mechanical breakdowns made it unpopular among the crews.

Entered into service in 1931, they were sent to Africa in 1937. One batailon came back to France in June 1940, to take part in the final battle. The survivors equipped the French army in North Africa, where they fought the Americans in November 1942 and then the Germans in Tunisia.

Identification: A narrower hull than its successor, the D-2. The return rollers are at the same height as the sprocket and the idler.

D-2



When the failings of the D-1 had become appearent, a new corrected model went out, with a more powerful engine and a reinforced armor. The delivreries started in 1934, and the two batch of 50 units were slowly issued until 1940. Most D-2 had the turret of the B1 Bis

This type of tank equipped De Gaulle's armored division which tried to counter-attack the Germans during the Campaign of France.

Identification: The superstructure of the hull is wider than on the model D-1. It hung over the tracks. The return rollers are placed higher than the sprocket and the idler. Somua S-35



The Somua S-35 was the finest French tank in 1940. It was fast, well-protected and armed with a powerful gun. Its main weakness was the one-seat turret, which overworked the tank commander and prevented him from fully exploiting the main armament.

After the defeat in 1940, some units were reused by the Germans. One of them, captured by the Yugoslav partisans, resumed the fighting on the allied side.

Identification: A higher superstructure as the D-2 with a longer gun and a larger cupola.

B1



The tank B was the most powerful vehicle on the battlefield in 1940, all sides taken together. It was a infantry tank, heavily armored and strongly armed.

The French rearmament plans, although boosted after 1936, did not make possible the building of many of those very costly machines.

Identification: Very similar to its follower, the B1 Bis, but can be distinguished by the gun in the turret, shorter and with a different mantlet and by the different shape of the engine top.

B1 Bis



Evolution of the B1, better armed (a longer 4.7 cm gun), with a better armor and a better engine. Very powerful, with impressive crossing abilities thanks to its overall tracks. Yet, it proved catastrophic on the battlefield. The crew was insufficient to serve this overly complex machine, the maintenance was too tricky for the conditions on the battlefield and its autonomy was too limited. The German tank and antitank guns could not achieve anything against the monster. But, the attackers had no problem harvesting the vehicles dispersed or abandonned because of the numerous mechanical breakdowns or the fuel shortages.

After the defeat, the Germans reused those tanks for occupation duties. 24 were reconverted as flamethrower and other in self-propelled guns. Some units fell in the hands of the Resistance in 1944, and fought with them among other in Paris.

Identification: Easily recognizable thanks to the huge hull and the overall tracks. The turret is small in comparison. In contrast to the model B1, the B1 bis had a longer gun in the turret. The engine top is also different.

B1 ter



Prototype designed to solve some of the problems of the previous models. The crew was increased to 5, the 7.5 cm gun in the hull had an enlarged traversed and the armor was thickened. Because of the production problems with the previous models, the B1 Ter was dropped.

2C



With 68 tons, this tank was outweighted only by the Jagdtiger.

The 2C was a breakthrough tank planned for the general offensive of 1919. It only entered in service in 1921. It is the first multiturreted machine. It was much too cumbersome to be of any use on a moving battlefield and its armor had become insufficient for the norms of 1940.

In 1940, the six remaining vehicles were sabotaged after having been immobilized by air attacks during their rail journeys. Identification: Externally, the 2C looks like a tank B1, but it had two turrets of different shapes. The dimensions are not the same either.

[SAMWolf]

Veterans for Constitution Restoration is a non-profit, non-partisan educational and grassroots activist organization. The primary area of concern to all VetsCoR members is that our national and local educational systems fall short in teaching students and all American citizens the history and underlying principles on which our Constitutional republic-based system of self-government was founded. VetsCoR members are also very concerned that the Federal government long ago over-stepped its limited authority as clearly specified in the United States Constitution, as well as the Founding Fathers' supporting letters, essays, and other public documents.

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************Snippy, I bequeath to you the FR TH PL.

148 posted on 08/24/2004 11:39:45 AM PDT by Cannoneer No. 4 (I've lost turret power; I have my nods and my .50. Hooah. I will stay until relieved. White 2 out.)

Check in Cannoneer, you okay out there buddy?

[Iris7]

One thing about the French in 1940, their radio communication really stank. Notice those tanks have no radios. As I recollect it took the French High Command twenty four hours to figure out that the Germans had really made a breakthrough at Sedan.

Speaking of Sedan, as I recollect, the German infantry took 20,000 casualties in forcing the Meuse. I recall reading that number somewhere, but can't find a reference.

[Aeronaut]

Good morning Snippy.

[alfa6]

Tread Head Tuesday Bump for the Freeper Foxhole

Regards

alfa6 ;>}

[GailA]

Good morning, we are finally starting to thaw out.

[The Mayor]

December 28, 2004

When God Thunders

Read: Psalm 81:6-10

You called in trouble, and I delivered you; I answered you in the secret place of thunder. —Psalm 81:7

Bible In One Year: Zechariah 5-8; Revelation 19

---

Thunder rolls across the Sawtooth Mountains, crashing and echoing through the peaks and canyons, shaking the ground with celestial sonic booms. My old dog cuts and runs. I stand amazed and delighted.

The storm reminds me of the "secret place of thunder" from which God answered His people (Psalm 81:7). Israel cried out from the straw pits and brick kilns of Egypt. In time, God's salvation rolled over the land in peals of thunder (Exodus 9:13-34).

Another psalm speaks of the storm that overshadowed Israel as they passed through the Red Sea (Psalm 77:16-20). Its thunder spelled doom for the Egyptians but deliverance to God's people. Each resounding clap was the comforting voice of a Father speaking to His children.

When Jesus foretold His death in John 12:28-29, He called on His Father to glorify His name. A voice answered from heaven saying, "I have both glorified it and will glorify it again." To the crowd, it sounded like thunder.

Are you in trouble? Cry out to God in your sorrow and distress. You may not hear the thunder roll, but it will reverberate through the heavens once again as He answers you "in the secret place of thunder." God will speak comfort to your heart and deliver you from your fears. —David Roper

The lightning of a mighty storm,
Its thunder from on high,
Reminds us that our powerful God
Will answer when we cry. —D. De Haan

Those who trust in God find comfort in His power.

[stand watie]

GM, Sam!

free dixie,sw

[soldierette]

It's Treadhead Tuesday!

 

 

Hi Sam! Hi Snippy! Good Morning everyone!

[stand watie]

GM, snippy!

off to Port A tomorrow AM! (BOO HOO!- i'd thought we were leaving TONIGHT!)

free dixie HUGS,duckie/sw

[stand watie]

interesting!

BUT did ANY of the frog tanks have more than one forward gear???

free dixie,sw

[E.G.C.]

Good morning, Snippy and everyone at the Foxhole.

[Soaring Feather]

Good morning everyone.

[Professional Engineer]

Good morning ladies. Flag-o-Gram.

[Professional Engineer]

I'm a Treadhead, she's a Treadhead, wouldn't you like to be a Treadhead too!

[Professional Engineer]

Howdy ma'am. Reported on time I see. ;-)