The Yankee Problem in America

LewRockwell.com ^ | April 24, 2003 | Clyde Wilson

[Celtjew Libertarian]

Gee, to your wife there are only two kinds of people from north of the Mason/Dixon....and neither is American...just a yankee or a northener? What kind of sense does that make?

More like two broad attitudes towards the South. Rather like Democrats and Republicans being broad, somewhat incomplete descriptions of competing view towards the government -- neither description being "American," either.

[Celtjew Libertarian]

I'm curious - what did Mark Spitz and Uri Geller have to do with it?

That is, she's had a thing for Jewish guys from way back. (I think she's mentioned having had a picture of Moshe Dayan, as well.) Me being Jewish isn't the whole basis of our relationship, but it hasn't exactly hurt, nu?

[#3Fan]

....this coming from a guy who has gotten into hundred-post rants about the meaning of "is" as it pertains to NASCAR.

You're lying again. Show me where I've debated anything of the sort on a NASCAR thread. (By the way, you're still following me to NASCAR threads, a topic in which you have no interest? mmm...mmm...mmm You just can't let your obsessions go can you? LOL)

Go figure. You have no arms or legs, Black Knight, yet you persist at biting kneecaps and claiming that you are winning. Now go away or I will taunt you some more

Ah, meaningless repetition. A common trait amongst those who inhabit padded cells.

[Non-Sequitur]

You beat out that poster of Mark Spitz in a speedo and wearing all those medals? I'm must say I'm impressed.

[Celtjew Libertarian]

What would the resulting countries, the USA and the CSA, look like today? Interesting to ponder.

You and I might be the only ones who would like to ponder that one. It is an interesting thought.

Make that three....

I wonder if slavery would have faded out on its own after several more generations. After all, many of the top leaders of the Confederacy had an ambiguous (at best) view of it (Robert E. Lee) or believed it was a temporary measure needed to bring the blacks up to civilization (Jefferson Davis, for example, who also gave hunting rifles, as gifts, to some of his slaves).

Also, industrialization was somewhat slower in the South than the north, but it likely would have increased in time, which would have lessened the demand for slaves.

And if this had happened with many interests still in common, it's possible that the Union and Confederacy would have re-united somewhen along the line.

Just one path of speculation.

[Celtjew Libertarian]

8>) Beat him out, no? Came close enough to type, yes.... Besides, I don't think Spitz was available. And I do have more facial hair, at least. 8>)

[nanny]

What no one ever mentions in the north south debate is that abolutionist were calling for the dissolution of the union prior to the Civil War. They felt that if the fed. government was going to compromise for any form of slavery that it would be more morale to just kick out the offending states.

Surely you don't mean it - not that Band of Angels up Nawth? Don't tell me we have been deceiv-ed all these years?

[wardaddy]

You don't have to make excuses for seeking your own tribe or someone who is readily compatible with your culture or just someone you "identify" with...

This notion that it's racist to prefer your own kind or a close facsimile is a new tool used by the left to beat normal folks over the head with and a handy moral pejorative label.

And folks who wish to dive out of the box may do so as well but it doesn't make them saints or morally superior.

[wardaddy]

LOL...

[seamas]

This article is on to something. I grew up in the Boston area in the 50-60s when there were no Catholics in the Eastern Yacht Club, etc. There was still prejudice against us Irish among what we then called Yankees. They were Al Gore types-all went to prep schools and then the Ivy League. After University I moved South and have never looked back. Disliked the arrogant, condescending b**tards! Hillary is the quintessential Yankee.

[nanny]

I know! How can one converse with out the warm, wonderful, and inclusive ya'll?

[seamas]

This article is on to something. I grew up in the Boston area in the 50-60s when there were no Catholics in the Eastern Yacht Club, etc. There was still prejudice against us Irish among what we then called Yankees. They were Al Gore types-all went to prep schools and then the Ivy League. After University I moved South and have never looked back. Disliked the arrogant, condescending b**tards! Hillary is the quintessential Yankee.

[Non-Sequitur]

Slavery would have lasted as long as southern society saw nothing wrong with it and that could easily been generations. Slavery was indeed an economic necessity for the southern plantation agriculture industry, as well as making up a significant percentage of the plantation owner's personal wealth. An alternative to slave labor was not readily available, and there was a stigma attached to a free laborer doing something a black slave had done. One can say that a fall in agricultural prices may have hastened the end of slavery, however that isn't a given since depressed prices would have caused the owners to keep slaves that they didn't pay. Some say that mechanization might have caused the end, but one has to remember that the first practical mechanical cotton picker was not introduced until the 1940's. So slavery would have had a long life ahead on the plantations.

But the plantation issue aside, a large percentage of slaves never saw a cotton field in their life. Slave ownership was very much a middle class institution in the south and many people living in urban areas owned slaves as butlers, cooks, maids, grooms, gardeners, etc. There was no economic need to get rid of them and again no ready replacement.

The only thing that would have ended slavery would have been a change in the view of southern society towards blacks in general and slaves in particular. There is no telling how long such a change would have taken.

[nanny]

I've often heard that there is a fine line between Texans and insanity.....

Boy you won't get any argument from me there - speaking for myself - it is one of our points of pride.

I know the name of the river - just wondered why someone was calling it Yellow instead of Red. Was it just a mix up of colors or a slur on the bravery of our good people?

[familyofman]

The writer is a complete a**. If it wasn't for my ancestors making this country what it is - this half-wit would have nothing to complain about.

Yes, I'm a PROUD YANKEE. My family arrived in the Boston area in 1642 (I'm a 15th generation here) and we have proudly fought in every conflict this country has had since the Revolution. Is this insipid pos a member of the D/SAR as I am - I doubt it.
There are at least 3 towns in this country named for my family, not to mention a retired US Navy ship. I'm every bit as proud of my heritage as any one from the South.
The problem in the country today is people like the idiot author who wants to divide the country accross fictional lines, as opposed to trying to work together.

[Celtjew Libertarian]

Personally, I've had far less grief about being Jewish from southerners than I had about being from a small town from northern urban types -- including Jews.

[wardaddy]

If you're bored:

http://www.cw-book-news.com/release%20info/00-fall/jewish.html

A great read....I have a signed copy.

[GOPcapitalist]

You're lying again. Show me where I've debated anything of the sort on a NASCAR thread.

Why don't you ask some of your associates over there. They're the ones that freepmailed me to inform me of your mental condition.

(By the way, you're still following me to NASCAR threads

I don't believe I've ever viewed a NASCAR thread here, though more than one freeper has described to me your bizarre behavior on them. I do find your paranoia amusing though. Tell me Ignatius, do you also have coathangers taped to the ceiling of your mother's basement to prevent "them" from stealing your thoughts at night?

[nanny]

And if this had happened with many interests still in common, it's possible that the Union and Confederacy would have re-united somewhen along the line.

Sure, that sounds reasonable and would slavery have died a natural death of course - it was too evil to not have done so. But as with most things, when the government decides to interfer, it creates more problems that last generations. Forced segregation for the most part, grew from and stayed in place as resentment for the federal government and the blacks suffered the backlash, wrong though it was.

I can't speak for slavery (not quite that old), I can speak for segregation. It would surely have died a natural death - it already was already dying. Now I don't have a problem with the black people who demonstrated and helped bring about the change faster. I do have a problem with interference from the government in the form of forced busing, quotas, affirmative action, etc., that have been an outgrowth of the governments so called good intentions. It will take generations to fix that problem, and has seperated the races more than they were before.

My thoughts - slavery would have died a natural death - but it would have been dead. The blacks would have had a place in the south as free men without the resentment caused by the federal government and the brutal reconstruction and the two would have reunited in time. I think it would have been a union with a much less centralized government than we now have.

[Celtjew Libertarian]

I'm not making excuses. I'm just amused by it -- and a bit proud that my kids are American Mutts (to use a term a friend of mine used to describe her ethnicity).

Actually, considering the treatment I've had from fellow Jews for being a Republican and from a small town, I don't really consider Jews my "tribe" -- Many of them out-"Yankee" the Anglo-Saxon "Yankees." I just consider Judaism my religion.

(My tribe is my extended family and close friends, but that starts a whole other philosophical discussion.)