Posted on 03/24/2014 10:59:55 AM PDT by JSDude1
Do lapsed Catholics count? That’s me.
I think I know what you are getting at...before answering, it is important to remember a very distinct difference between Catholic and other Christian faiths. In most Christian faiths, it is taken for granted than man can learn about Jesus and God, and even form opinions about them. Men can go to divinity school, do bible studies on their interpretation of the bible, write papers etc. Its almost like an academic pursuit - where there is still knowledge left to be discovered, and the knowledge we do know can be debated.
Not so in the Catholic church. There is one truth..that’s it. Its known, and a very centralized system spreads the word of the truth to the masses. Until very recently, it was deemed so unimportant that the masses be able to debate and discuss the truth, that mass was done in an obscure language hardly spoken (I took 5 years of Latin btw).
So its not the type of situation where you might pick up a new book at a Christian bookstore, and think ‘hey, maybe this will give a new perspective on Sunday’. So it would be very rare that a Protestant pamphlet, etc. were brought into a Catholic church.
Now I have to say, we always operated as if Protestants didn’t exist. Not once in the 18 years I was in weekly attendance at mass did I ever hear a word about protestants, or any kind of comparison, us vs them, etc. I’ve been to many protestant services in my life, been in the Boy Scouts in a Methodist church, etc...and quite frankly the reverse is not true. Often Protestants like to compare themselves to Catholics...sometimes even mocking our rituals...often telling jokes about the Pope...and sometimes in the middle of a service a minister will describe why Protestants are superior in thinking than Catholics. I even had a Protestant room-mate who was convince I was going to hell, because I had not been ‘saved’...i.e I had not made it to his level of enlightenment. So I think its natural for Protestants to assume the same type of comparison happens with Catholics.
But it really doesn’t. Catholics really don’t view Protestants as a ‘competing’ religion...might have been different in the days of Martin Luther, but not now.
Well I wouldn’t obviously want to do that, but BBQ any other time, I’m sure they’d happily partake ;).
One of my childhood memories is remembering my father sing Amazing Grace around the house. He was from a devout catholic family and attended catholic school while growing up.
He was born in 1944.
And it was sung often in our church in the 70’s and 80’s.
I have no idea how long its been considered ‘ok’...but its been a while.
I could not find the source, but I remember this issue came up about a year ago with some traditional Catholics. I don’t know the exact terms for them, but it is my understanding that you cannot have flowers on the altar where the priest is consecrating the host. I have always seen flowers on the back (?) altar where the tabernacle usually is. But, after this came up, I don’t recall ever seeing flowers on the front (?) altar.
Well I really don’t focus on Catholic teachings, or things about that Church while I gather with others, but I think you’ve come close to hitting the heart of this issue:
1) Do we actually believe what God says in the Bible is true?
2) If the Bible is true, then we must believe Christ (and what He says in how we must be saved). John 3.
Really it matters not to me what Church one attends (or does not attend), what matters is if one has believed in Christ how He has said we must (John Chapter 3, etc..).
No.
Was part of the flower issue that it was Lent?
Don’t forget to invite your Muslim friends during Ramadan.
We went to Mass in Latin yesterday and today. It is easy to understand the Latin used in Mass after reading and hearing it for a little while.
Many, many books about Our Lord and His Sacrifice and history of the Church have been around for hundreds of years in vernacular languages and people have been discussing them for as long. Those written in Latin, the language of learning which bound the scholastic world together for centuries, have been available in translation for debate and discussion for quite some time.
Ah...it seems I was pretty close to the issue at hand - being ‘saved’.
My Protestant room-mate was quite sure I was doomed...and very despondent that his Catholic grandmother was as well.
There is salvation in the Catholic religion...you just take a different road to get there. Now I’m no theologian, so that’s as far as I get.
Now I posed this question to my room-mate (who was academically very smart): “What about people in the middle of the jungle who have never heard of the Christian religion - are every single one of them doomed to hell?”. He couldn’t give me a good answer to that question. I suspect a just God would not create a world where half its inhabitants had never even heard of the one religion that would save them from eternal damnation...and the answer to my question is ‘no, not everybody in the remote jungle will go to hell’. If my suspicion is correct, the notion that all Catholics are going to hell starts to unravel.
I will say this. Our little Catholic church got started in Alabama in the 1970’s, where we were regarded as ‘weird’. We had mass in a trailer. And that was trailer sat in.....a Methodist church parking lot! The Methodists had shown Christian kindness and offered up the space, until our parish could purchase land and build a church building. Later in life that same Methodist church took me into their Boy Scout program (my church didn’t have one), without reservation, and made me feel completely at home. So I have no quarrel with Protestants.
My brother recently got married. His wife is around 40, and they were required to go to marriage classes, as per usual in the catholic church. Now my brother is Catholic and she is Protestant. She went to the classes almost against her will...but loved them. She found the Catholic church to be very refreshing, and has since ‘converted’. It turns out that she had grown up with a very incorrect idea of what it was like in a Catholic church. So, my recommendation is go to mass a few times. You can see for yourself what a Catholic church is like - for most people it is not at all what they thought it would be.
I know...we should have a thread that pits Freeper Catholics against Freeper Protestants. Nothing could advance the cause of conservatism more after all.
Yes on the music & books - not so much with TV & sermons, but I don’t watch much TV - or EWTN either.
Oh the sarcasm which can only be from Jesuit education:) Been there.
No, there's still so much Catholic material I haven't gotten to yet. Our parish music director is a Protestant and he's even more of a trad than I am when it comes to music... neither of us has any use for "contemporary" music. When he was hired the entire adult choir quit when he excised all the goopy "Jesus is my boyfriend" music, what's hysterical about it is nobody has really noticed they aren't there anymore and it's been years.
Seriously though, it's kind of like asking a republican if he reads any democrat party literature; after all we're all Americans aren't we?
Yes to books and movies. While I would read the King James Bible, I would study my own Catholic Bibles and do attend Catholic Bible studies. Christian music is a definite yes. Nice to have rock style music with wholesome lyrics. I occasionally listen to sermons/teachings on the radio, but often find areas I question. Don’t like Joyce Meyer’s teachings much, for instance. We are all Christians and I do feel we have lots more in common, than we have differences. Of course, discussion with non-Catholics here on FR is often the pits. Lots of haters here. We Catholics seem lots more tolerant of non-Catholic Christians. Enough of my rambling. Good question.
Bookmarked for images. Thanks.
I hope I didn’t come across as not liking the centralized structure of the Catholic church. I find it very comforting that there is ‘one truth’...that doesn’t change.
Contrasted to some of the Protestant churches in my area that practically encourage homosexuality, and a variety of other progressive notions, the ‘one word’ of the Catholic church cannot change - that’s a good thing.
But make no mistake - the concept of a ‘Shepherd’ and his ‘Flock’...and the term ‘Father’ for a priest set up a situation where the people come to church to be informed...not to break up into small groups and do a bible study and place bullet points on a pad of butcher block paper.
And as far as Latin goes...this was one of the major things Martin Luther did, contrary to the wishes of the Catholic church...i.e., he translated the Bible into a commonly spoken language (German) for the first time. Prior to that, the sheep in the flock were not meant to read it themselves...rather, their father the priest would read it for them, and tell them the story or sermon about it.
Its a very important distinction that separates Catholics from Protestants. Yes this line has been blurred by eliminating the Latin mass as a requirement, and translating bibles...but the notion of ‘Shepherd and Flock’ is still very much a part of the Catholic church.
Again - I don’t think this is a bad thing.
And as an aside, I took 5 years of Latin....so I know a little bit about it. When you hear church Latin and ‘understand’ it....it is understood like I understand Spanish tv. I’ve never learned Spanish...but based on the situation and the few words that are similar to English, I can tell what’s going on. So I ‘understand’ it. But I couldn’t have a deep philosophical discussion in it, or hardly form my own sentences in Spanish. If I really want to know everything that’s going on with Spanish tv, I’m either going to learn Spanish or find an English translation. Short of that, I’m only getting half the meaning.
Bibles, no, because there are too many differences.
Contemporary pop Christian music, no; liturgical music, yes. Basically, if religious music can’t be played in Mass, we don’t listen to it. We do listen to some totally secular music, though.
My children listen to “AIO” from Focus on the Family.
Story books and Protestant Christian novels, no. Catholic only, unless they are Christian without having been written specifically for that audience. For example, the “Little House” books are fine.
Yeah, it’s mean. But it’s funny.
and disrespectful...
while your at it why not do it on Good Friday when Catholics are fasting and abstaining from meat....
or better yet while they are over bash Mary...
then you would have the real anti-Catholic trifecta.
Ad Majoram Dei Gloriam
For the Greater Glory of God
For the Greater Glory of God
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.