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Archbishop Chaput Closes Fortnight: What We Must Render Unto God and Unto Caesar
Catholic Online ^ | 7/5/12 | Deacon Keith Fournier

Posted on 07/05/2012 9:22:07 AM PDT by marshmallow

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1 posted on 07/05/2012 9:22:15 AM PDT by marshmallow
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To: marshmallow

I clicked on the Vatican link and got connected to: The Holy Shroud: One Big Bang and the body was gone.


2 posted on 07/05/2012 9:34:03 AM PDT by GreyFriar (Spearhead - 3rd Armored Division 75-78 & 83-87)
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To: marshmallow

I clicked on the Vatican link and got connected to: The Holy Shroud: One Big Bang and the body was gone.


3 posted on 07/05/2012 9:34:20 AM PDT by GreyFriar (Spearhead - 3rd Armored Division 75-78 & 83-87)
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To: marshmallow

What an amazingly confusing garble of newspeak was uttered by the ‘pathetic’ spokesman for the current pope who heads the new religion established subsequent to Vatican II.

Obfuscation results from using utterly confusing phrases and terms to deliberately shroud what this new religion is really all about.


4 posted on 07/05/2012 9:44:35 AM PDT by IbJensen (If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed, if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed)
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To: marshmallow
Nor can the critical and essential intention of this fortnight, the protection and preservation of religious freedom, actually come to an end.

Well isn't that special. Religious freedom is essential and a necessary condition to being a free person; however, it is not a sufficient condition. We must also have economic freedom to enjoy the fruits of our labors. This is something that the Catholic Church preaches AGAINST in their pastoral letter Economic Justice for All.

This letter (quite long btw) has such gems in it as "70. Distributive justice requires that the allocation of income, wealth, and power in society be evaluated in light of its effects on persons whose basic material needs are unmet." and ""It is of the very essence of social justice to demand from each individual all that is necessary for the common good." and "74. Basic justice also calls for the establishment of a floor of material well-being on which all can stand. This is a duty of the whole of society and it creates particular obligations for those with greater resources. This duty calls into question extreme inequalities of income and consumption when so many lack basic necessities."

Since the thing runs to 90 pages I will let you read it yourself to see how contradictory the official position of the church is with tru economic freedom.

5 posted on 07/05/2012 9:51:04 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: from occupied ga

You seem to have confused the Liberation Theology promoted by the USCCB, for the “Teachings of the Catholic Church”.

They are NOT the same thing!


6 posted on 07/05/2012 10:00:20 AM PDT by G Larry (I'm under no obligation to be a passive victim!)
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To: G Larry
They are NOT the same thing!

A distinction without a difference. Where then are the “Teachings of the Catholic Church?” Where are the official positions of the Catholic church if not in the USCCB? (Keeping in mind that one of those quotes was from a pope, not the USCBB.

7 posted on 07/05/2012 10:07:28 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: from occupied ga

The Teachings of the Catholic Church are found in the unadultrated Bible and are explained in the Catechism.

Since the link is blown, please provide the quote from the Pope, and I’ll be happy to address it.
Although, I susspect AB Chaput has done that work already in “Render unto Caeser”.
Charity is not the job of the government.


8 posted on 07/05/2012 10:19:02 AM PDT by G Larry (I'm under no obligation to be a passive victim!)
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To: G Larry
http://www.usccb.org/upload/economic_justice_for_all.pdf
paragraph #71. BTW the link works for me. When the entire church hierarchy says one thing, and some poster on FR says no no that isn't the real teaching, I get a little skeptical as to what the “Real teaching is.” The USCCB represents the official church hierarchy. You can claim they're not official, but in reality they are the voice of the church that everyone hears no matter how FOS the stuff they put out is.

Also I hear the same crap from the pulpit. I have yet to hear a priest who ever said "Poverty is a voluntary choice. People who don't want to be poor should work harder." or words to that effect. To the contrary, I am ceaslessly exhorted to give more and to "give back." etc. I have a special problem with the phrase "giving back." I can't give back anything that was't given to me in the first place. If I earned it, then I can give it or not give it, but I can't give it back. The church goes along with the 0bama philosophy that everything you have was given to you by the government. In fact with the exception of things to do with reproduction, and euthanasia, the church's stand on political matters pretty musch corresponds to that of the liberal wing of the Democratic party.

9 posted on 07/05/2012 10:47:55 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: G Larry
Charity is not the job of the government.

It happens only when the government tries to replace religion.

10 posted on 07/05/2012 10:48:05 AM PDT by Pecos ("We hold these truths to be self-evident ..... ")
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To: from occupied ga
"Well isn't that special."

If you are able to completely compartmentalize your moral life such that your economic and spiritual lives are in no way intertwined I pity you.

If you believe that human dignity realized in community with others, is the not criterion against which all aspects of economic life must be measured, from the moment of conception until the instance of natural death I pity you.

If you are able to convince yourself that you are in no way responsible for the millions in our community, country and around the world who hunger, thirst, and suffer, I pity you.

If you do not think that we as Christians will be individually judged by what we do and fail to do for the least of His brethren, I pity you. When Christians look into the face of those in need we do not look first to see if it looks like our face, we only see Jesus' face.

Christianity is not some abstract or hypothetical thought process played out only in pews or in internet forums, it is a way of life.

Peace be with you.

11 posted on 07/05/2012 11:32:32 AM PDT by Natural Law (Jesus did not leave us a Bible, He left us a Church.)
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To: from occupied ga

“The USCCB represents the official church hierarchy”

NOT when they contradict the Vatican!
Which has happend all too often in the last 50 years!


12 posted on 07/05/2012 11:34:12 AM PDT by G Larry (I'm under no obligation to be a passive victim!)
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To: from occupied ga

You need to quit going to the Church closest to your front door and find one that is faithful to the Vatican.

I drive an extra 5 miles for that reason.


13 posted on 07/05/2012 11:36:42 AM PDT by G Larry (I'm under no obligation to be a passive victim!)
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Comment #14 Removed by Moderator

To: from occupied ga
"Well aren't you the sanctimonious little pharisee."

I am a sinner on a pilgrimage of conversion who once saw the world as you do.

Peace be with you

15 posted on 07/05/2012 11:55:45 AM PDT by Natural Law (Jesus did not leave us a Bible, He left us a Church.)
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To: from occupied ga
Basic justice also calls for the establishment of a floor of material well-being on which all can stand. This is a duty of the whole of society and it creates particular obligations for those with greater resources. This duty calls into question extreme inequalities of income and consumption when so many lack basic necessities.

Hmmm, Thou shall not steal; Thou shall not steal as a means to secure votes; Thou shall not steal as a means to vote in politicians that will make one comfortable in their sloth; Thou shall not steal as a means to lobby a secular government to provide for social justice; Thou shall not steal as a means to fund social justice through a barrel of a gun, threat of fine, and imprisonment.

Jesus must of been one heartless Jew due to the fact that lobbying Caesar to fund His projects was not even a thought or necessity. I guess an earthly bureacracy has their drawbacks along with the tyrannical emerging Roman Empire taking the place of the Republic. Give to Caesar what Caesar wants, not lobby Caesar to get what one deems holy.

Is Sainthood looming for Obama and many democrats like Pelosi? There distribution schemes for the poor are legend, plus they are supposedly Christian.

Does charity = lobbying through force of government to fund bloated bureacracies or free will from the potential giver directly to the reciever? Bishops, take your pick then cease the audacious verbosity because they are siding with the bureacratic $16,000,000,000,000 beast that is destroying religious freedom.
16 posted on 07/05/2012 12:34:18 PM PDT by rollo tomasi (Working hard to pay for deadbeats and corrupt politicians)
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To: from occupied ga
When the entire church hierarchy says one thing,
The USCCB represents the official church hierarchy.

Nonsense. Only the obtuse would confuse that collective cabal of navel gazing buffoons at the USCCB with "the entire church hierarchy".

I'll bet you've never read QUOD APOSTOLICI MUNERIS or DIUTURNUM or LIBERTAS PRAESTANTISSIMUM, ad infinitum.

17 posted on 07/05/2012 1:43:41 PM PDT by A.A. Cunningham (Barry Soetoro is a Kenyan communist)
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To: GreyFriar
Archbishop Chaput Closes Fortnight: What We Must Render Unto God and Unto Caesar
18 posted on 07/05/2012 1:50:03 PM PDT by A.A. Cunningham (Barry Soetoro is a Kenyan communist)
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To: rollo tomasi
"Jesus must of been one heartless Jew due to the fact that lobbying Caesar to fund His projects was not even a thought or necessity."

Your objections seem to be based upon a premise that Catholics are outsiders to the political process and do not pay taxes. One in four Americans is Catholic and as such have significant input into the policies and spending decisions of this country.

The agenda of the Catholic Church is set by the Gospel of Jesus Christ and is not subject to the influence of Conservatives or Liberals or any single nation. Catholic allegiance is rightly first to God, not to country, party or political ideology. We are citizens of heaven first. We are patriots only to the degree that this country serves God and we best serve this country when we serve God. If you believe that the Church's position on abortion, religious freedom, euthanasia, opposition to communism, and defense of marriage is contrary to American interests then perhaps it is your agenda that is in need of change.

Peace be with you

19 posted on 07/05/2012 2:30:20 PM PDT by Natural Law (Jesus did not leave us a Bible, He left us a Church.)
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To: marshmallow
The link only goes to an article on the shroud. What?
20 posted on 07/05/2012 2:50:49 PM PDT by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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