Posted on 06/27/2011 7:13:27 AM PDT by marbren
The LCMS isn't part of this lawsuit.
I think all religious institutions are very interested in the ruling on this case. It will defiantly set some precedents.
I believe I read that the Doctors said with her medication her condition was manageable and she could return to work. I also wonder what her "Call" covenant contract says. I would say that whatever the written contract says should be binding.
You did read that, but who should determine whether someone with a 'manageable' condition can do the job required, the employer, the doctor or the gov't?
What about the called teacher?
What about her? If she can't do the job as defined, should she receive pay forever? Who decides: employer, doctor or gov't?
So you are saying the church should be in control of the people that work there or that an outside agent should be in control, which is it?
Re: your use of the word Pharisee as a pejorative. Pharisees were all about rules. Aren’t you? In this case work rules etc.
The Holy Spirit should decide. For a called minister the Holy Spirit tells them when and where to go. Heresy and immoral life are the only grounds for dismissal. Politics should not decide. This church may be heterodox.
And yet, the congregation issues the call. So once a call is accepted, a called minister has tenure. And as long as he isn't immoral or heretical, he can't be removed. One can cause upheaval, can play 'politics', can be a lousy preacher, not visit the sick etc, but as long as he is moral and non-heretical, he is good to go.
This church may be heterodox.
Really quite an accusation, care to provide any proof of heterodox doctrine, or are you just throwing that out to see if it sticks?
exactly.
Really quite an accusation, care to provide any proof of heterodox doctrine, or are you just throwing that out to see if it sticks?
I did say may be heterodox.
So a pastor doesn't have to do his job, but if the congregation screws up and calls him, they should be stuck with him until he decides to leave. Another reason I am thankful you don't go to my church and that there IS recourse in the case of an unprofitable calling. You may have your Pater Noster, I've seen what they can do.
They do as regards nontaxable organization status. Now, that is not necessarily defining what "church" is, just whether or not what they are and do allows them to be tax exempt.
I do realize that and I should have been clearer. This case seems to be more about the government defining a religious institution’s scope of minsitry, which to me is trying to define “church”.
I believe this is about whether the teacher is exempt from the ADA re: her dismissal. ADA requires that employers make reasonable accomodations to those who are disabled as defined in the act when they are requested to do so by the employee. They are to do this provided the essential nature of the job function is not compromised by the accomodation. Rasonable accomodation may be special equipment, it may be being reassigned to another post, it might be different hours. I suppose for a teacher with narcolepsy it might be to have an aide in the classroom to protect her from self injury and to wake her up.
The Church probably required a fitness for duty report and the Doctor gave them a report which said she was o.k to return to work if on medication. The employer is not obligated to agree with the report but is free to make its own decision. The ADA claim is a separate issue since having a disability that can be controlled or relieved by medication does not mean you are no longer disabled.
This teacher believes and the EEOC agrees she was discriminated against under ADA. The CHurch and those filing the Amicus Curae dispute that claiming a determination in her favor is a major government intrustion into the self determination of religious organizations.
The Holy Spirit is sitting this one out.
My position is that the Holy Spirit does, and maintains, and is responsible for the call, Not weeds and pharisees and politicians and man made institutions.
BTW let's try to keep focus on this called minister teacher in Michigan.
IMHO, This case is going to be a big deal in the church state separation discussions. Especially the ministerial exception. Ministers today have no protection in man made worldly pharisaic religious institutions.
Not weeds and pharisees and politicians and man made institutions.
Which inhabit the church on earth and certainly the 'man-made' parochial schools, to ignore that fact is to be as bad as a liberal, denying the reality of fallen life on earth.
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