Catholic scholar dismantles May 21 Judgment Day claims

cna ^ | May 20, 2011 | Marianne Medlin

[Mad Dawg]

Ping to #22.

For me personally, I find it useless to converse, except about things like the weather or politics, with people who think they know what I think better than I do.

[bibletruth]

Christ Jesus said we are the light to the world, light does not cower and hide in a closet. St Paul rightly said via the inspiration of the Holy Ghost, that we are ambassadors for Christ; ambassadors do not cower and hide in a closet. If someone, as I do, proclaim Christ is risen, Christ is the only way to heaven, then I do correctly to proclaim it in public. I am an evangelist and no need to hide my faith and secure standing with God and Christ. I am not ashamed of the gospel. You criticize my character in order to match you presumptuous of how a Saint-Believer must act: but you completely miss the weight and gravity of more important issues regarding salvation. Christianity is equally measured on what we say and believe, not merely alone on how we humbly go quietly about our lives.

[bronx2]

Revelation is the work Luther and other reformers wanted to excise. This latest individual prideful interpretation of scripture is a product of C.I. Schofield who produced a bible in the late 1800"s with copious notes. Schofield sees everything thru a "Dispensationalist " lens and tries to decode the plan God.

Therefore, the Dispensationalists are the very ones who criticize Catholics for the magisterium yet look what evil they have fostered on Christians with Camping and his many predecessors.

The advocates of dispensationalism and Sola Scriptura will argue they are not as loony as Camping but their methodology and foundational assumptions, based on their individual interpretation of scripture, is no better than what they allege to be the man made doctrines of Catholics.

The prideful interpretations of the ones preaching the Rapture like Camping have no moral authority other than each other, because for each of them, it is just them and their bible.

These dispensationalists treat the bible as a supernatural code book, a fortune tellers code book. These Sola Scriptura types, with their cataclysmic prognostications, have always been wrong, and as such demonstrate lamentable ignorance of sacred scripture.

Rapture types know they will eventually die so they predict the whole world will die instead . It is a sick kind of twist in the human heart and imagination to look at Christianity to be a laughable religion for inadequate loonies.

[Lee N. Field]

To be fair, Protestant scholars are also debunking this latest absurdity from Mr. Camping. There is no Protestant church that will own him.

Harold Camping dates the removal of the Holy Spirit from the churches to the time he was removed from teaching at the last church he was in, 22 years ago.

[bibletruth]

I am in the true Church: I have never fallen away: my name is written in the book of life

• I am in the true Church: Colossians 1:18 And HE is the HEAD of the body, the Church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead. Christ is the head of the Church of which I belong to, a body of believers not made with earthen hands.
• I have never fallen away: Romans 8:38-39 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord
• God knows my name; God has my name written in the Lamb's book of life [Rev 21:27]; [Philippians 4:3] ...whose names are in the book of life.

  [Phil 4:4] I rejoice in the Lord alway: which means all-the-way (not always, different word). All-the-way implies all the way to the end of my physical life, when then I am escorted to heaven by the angels.

  Christ welcomes back those who have not the complete truth. You aught to consider Christ's free gift of salvation by faith alone, in Christ alone, for salvation.

[bibletruth]

Of course only a fool would deny that it was not that very Jewish women named Mary, who was given the privilege to give birth to the humanity of Jesus. I do not deny it.

But not once - NOT EVER - does the Bible refer to Mary as Capital -O- Our; Capital -L- Lady; Mary. NOT EVER does the Bible ever deify Mary with capital letters, which are reserved alone for God, Christ, Holy Spirit, Holy Ghost, Godhead, which designate deity. Mary is not deity, so stop capitalizing adjectives and pronouns before Mary's name: for that clearly makes here out to be reserved as deity. Read English grammar is you don't believe either God or me on this matter.

[bibletruth]

ITS ALL BIBLICAL: ITS NOT SLAPPED TOGETHER:

Since I only quote from the Bible, this is NOT off topic!

That the book of Revelation has Mary misrepresented in Revelation 12. The women in Rev 12 being with child IS ISRAEL, because Israel has the genealogy of Messiah, not the Catholics.

Rev 12+Mary is a private interpretation by a group of like minded interpreters...

Rev 22:18-19 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that re written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out the the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

For in that HE died, HE died unto sin ONCE: but in that HE liveth, HE liveth unto God. Romans 6:10

For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God. Romans 3:23

[Mad Dawg]

I'm intrigued by your take on παντοτε in Phil 4:4.

[bibletruth]

Regarding heaven, maybe you can take a Biblical lesson from Revelation 17:8 where it mentions that some will not be going to heaven:

17:8 ...and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names WERE NOT written in the book of life from the foundation of the world...

Furthermore, try learning directly from Jesus in Matthew 25:31-46, read this and see if you find that ALL go to heaven!

31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth [his] sheep from the goats:

33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:

36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.

37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed [thee]? or thirsty, and gave [thee] drink?

38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took [thee] in? or naked, and clothed [thee]?

39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?

40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done [it] unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done [it] unto me.

41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:

43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.

44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did [it] not to one of the least of these, ye did [it] not to me.

46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

This is not some cute game I am playing, as you falsely claim. I am not ashamed of the Gospel of Christ. I plead with all whom I meet to believe in Christ's saving grace. I plead with you to put down childish things and move unto the meat of the Word of God, and forsake the way of Cain...

[allmendream]

I will pray for you.

[Claud]

Who’s deifying anyone? Not I. Deifying Mary is a rank heresy which should be condemned vehemently, roundly, and absolutely.

Our Lady is an honorific. You know, like Lady Diana. Notice the caps?

I don’t think anyone deified her, did they?

[bibletruth]

Thank you. But if you pray...pray this for me:

18 Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;

19 And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel,

20 For which I am an ambassador in bonds: that therein I may speak boldly, as I ought to speak. Ephesians 6:18-20

For I too am an ambassador, and I too aught to speak boldly the unsearchable riches of Christ. Pray [Ephesians 3:8] that I should preach among the Gentiles the UNSEARCHABLE RICHES of Christ;

Don't pray for my salvation: I ALREADY HAVE ETERNAL SALVATION. You cannot change what I already possess...

[Larry Lucido]

I can dismantle it on May 22.

[bibletruth]

I agree...Deifying Mary is a rank heresy which should be condemned vehemently, roundly, and absolutely. It is not Biblical. Sorry if I misunderstood your earlier ping. I only wish to expose this heresy to the Catholics.

[NYer]

Deifying Mary is a rank heresy

All Catholics agree with that statement.

[allmendream]

Yes, and you also suffer under the delusion you are a Saint.

I will pray for you and your pride and ignorance.

All are fallen. All fall short. Other than you apparently.

I will pray for you and hope you find Jesus.

[bibletruth]

Delusion of being a Saint...you have a poor understanding of the Word of God

Try reading God's Word on the word "Saint" - it is not reserved only for Catholics - but ALL Christian sons of God, Children of God. God's Word defines and declares who is a Saint, not men.

Ephesians 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the SAINTS, and of the household of God;

Romans 15:25 But now I go unto Jerusalem to minister unto the SAINTS.

2 Thessalonians 1:10 When he shall come to be glorified in his SAINTS, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

Romans 15:31 That I may be delivered from them that do not believe in Judaea; and that my service which [I have] for Jerusalem may be accepted of the SAINTS;

Ephesians 3:18 May be able to comprehend with all SAINTS what [is] the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;

Colossians 1:4 Since we heard of your faith in Christ Jesus, and of the love [which ye have] to all the SAINTS,

Romans 16:15 Salute Philologus, and Julia, Nereus, and his sister, and Olympas, and all the SAINTS which are with them.

2 Corinthians 8:4 Praying us with much intreaty that we would receive the gift, and [take upon us] the fellowship of the ministering to the SAINTS.

Ephesians 1:15 Wherefore I also, after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus, and love unto all the SAINTS,

Ephesians 3:8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all SAINTS, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;

Ephesians 4:12 For the perfecting of the SAINTS, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

Colossians 1:26 Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his SAINTS:

Revelation 18:24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of SAINTS, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the SAINTS: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Psalms 16:3 But to the SAINTS that are in the earth, and to the excellent, in whom [is] all my delight.

Romans 12:13 Distributing to the necessity of SAINTS; given to hospitality.

1 Corinthians 6:1 Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the SAINTS?

Psalms 89:7 God is greatly to be feared in the assembly of the SAINTS, and to be had in reverence of all them that are about him.

Psalms 116:15 Precious in the sight of the LORD is the death of his SAINTS. [And that's not talking about Catholics, but real Christians who are saved by grace and the faith OF Christ]

It is the Catholics that have a delusion about the definition of a Saint. The Bible Saint is far more precious than the so called Catholic saint.

[bibletruth]

So now after you read these BIBLE Scriptures that define and declare SAINTS: try and deny it that it is God who DOES NOT define and declare who is a SAINT...

[Claud]

You didn’t misunderstand. I am Catholic.

NYer is correct. Any Catholic who believes that Mary is God commits a heresy of the highest order.

I should point out that I’ve never in my 40 years as a Catholic met someone who did.

[CTrent1564]

bible truth:

Catholic Theology sees the Woman in Revelation 12 to mean the Church, Israel and Mary, and because the Catholic Church has a much deeper theological depth to Scripture than Fundies like Camp and most American rural Protestants, the Catholic Church’s interpretation of Scripture capture the more theological meanings that The “private interpretations” of Fundalmentalist Protestants.

As for Mary being interpreted as the Woman of Revelation 12, as early as St. Epiphanius of Salamis [circa 320 to 403 AD], Mary was interpreted as being the Woman of Revelation 12 [that is 1100 years before the Protestantism].

The parallel between Mary and the Church is found with St. Ambrose in the 4th century as well as St. Augustine, St. Clement of Alexandria, St. Gregory of Nazianzen, Pope Gregory the Great, who all lived in the Patristic Period, and thus these Church Fathers also can be seen as providing evidence of Revelation 12 meaning Mary as the Mary-Church link was often made by the Church Fathers.

So your interpretation regarding Revelation 12 is not accepted by the consensus of the great theologians of the early Church. In fact, your Fundamentalist “bibletruth” interpretation is refuted time and time again.