Polygamy is in on TV: Lifetime's “The 19th Wife” Monday Sept. 13, previews

Monsters and Critics.com ^ | Sept. 10, 2010 | April MacIntyre

[Colofornian]

From the preview: These women are hoodwinked that the only way they get through the afterlife's "pearly gates" is as some man's plus one, or in their case, part of a harem of sister wives.

Well, indeed, Mormon women had little choice in the 19th century re: marriage. Little choice, that is, especially if you consider that they were told if they didn't marry, they wouldn't reach the highest level (of three) in heaven.

Actually, that doctrine still exists within the Mormon church. The difference is that imagine you were told that in the 1800s and polygamy was billed as "THE WAY."

From the preview: “The 19th Wife” tells the tale of the murder mystery of a polygamist on a fictional southern Utah compound overlayed with flashbacks to one of Young’s wives, Ann Eliza Young, trying to break away from her marriage to the second president of the LDS Church. The story shows the trials of one modern day young wife to Ann Eliza’s struggle to free herself from Brigham Young’s grasp.

She did indeed divorce Brigham Young. I mean Young had over two dozen wives and over 50 kids. If a Mormon male today lived long enough, and married 19 women consecutively as each died off...and if he married each in the Mormon temple "for eternity"...then guess what? Current Mormon policy would say this man would be a polygamist in the afterlife with 19 wives!

(So much for Mormons hoodwinking the public into thinking polygamy was only a yesteryear deal)

[HerrBlucher]

And why not? According to the gay marriage advocates, its unfair to restrict marriage to one man one woman, in fact, its unfair to restrict marriage at all, and sheep or goats can’t complain about a headache.

[Rodamala]

Because TPIWWP...

With 4 at-bats per inning... who knows what's hittable? Still, I'm curious what the boxscore will look like in the end.

Runs? Hits? Heirs?

Hahahahah!

[metmom]

The story shows the trials of one modern day young wife to Ann Eliza’s struggle to free herself from Brigham Young’s grasp.

Too many men seem to consider a marriage license a bill of sale.

[LearnsFromMistakes]

When I flipped by this station this weekend, I figured this story was gonna be about a golfing widow or some such. Honest...I don’t get out much...

[Paragon Defender]

If you are reading this thread and are curious about polygamy and how it related to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, do yourself a favor and understand that most of the posts on this board that could be related to the LDS church in any way are posted and commented on by anti-Mormon activists. It should be fairly easy to figure out who they are. You will get their spin on it, their translation of it and their opinion of it. Surely you don’t base your conclusions on information from only one source do you?

Then do yourself a favor. Don’t take their word for it. Find out for yourself. Put forth some effort. You do want the truth right? Prove it.

Read both sides. Talk to both sides. Not just mine. Not just theirs. Make up your own mind.

Here’s a few links to get your started from a different viewpoint. The vast majority of the issues brought up can be found and addressed at http://www.fairlds.org/ I have found but here’s more.

http://scriptures.lds.org/
http://www.lds.org
http://www.fairlds.org/
http://www.mormonwiki.com/Main_Page
http://www.lightplanet.com/response/index.html
http://www.jefflindsay.com/LDS_Intro.shtml
http://www.answeringantimormons.com/index.htm
http://promormon.blogspot.com/

[Colofornian]

By all means, ALL, whenever you're shopping for a used car, do what PD tells you: Don't just rely upon Consumer Reports & similar published & online sources, do what PD tells you to do: Get the scoop straight from the used car dealer!

And if you're not satisfied only with that, ask the used car dealer for links to his in-house used car dealers & advocacy sources! Get both sides (and know who to trust!)

[svcw]

Thanks again. I love that you supply these links (just like the so called antis do) because it makes clear what a fraud lds is.

[greyfoxx39]

that most of the posts on this board that could be related to the LDS church in any way are posted and commented on by anti-Mormon activists. It should be fairly easy to figure out who they are. You will get their spin on it, their translation of it and their opinion of it.

There is NOTHING preventing mormons from posting "most of the posts on this board that could be related to the LDS church" other than perhaps, cowardliness.

[patriot08]

I was gonna tape it but couldn’t find it listed.

[caww]

Well, one of our own Freeepers, a Mormon, has on his page his belief in many wives but says it is not practiced because it is against our laws. So there you have it. How many would do so indeed if it were allowed? I think many if they could afford to do so.

[Colofornian]

Well, one of our own Freeepers, a Mormon, has on his page his belief in many wives but says it is not practiced because it is against our laws. So there you have it. How many would do so indeed if it were allowed? I think many if they could afford to do so.

Exactly. There's some Mormon FReepers among us who were adults -- or at least had parents who were adults -- in 1963 when the following survey was taken:

"Another survey taken in the 1960s found that not only do contemporary church members overwhelmingly disapprove of polygamy but only two in five said they would enter the principle if commanded by the prophets." [B. Carmon Hardy, Solemn Covenant, p. 339, citing survey published in 1963 by John R. Christiansen, "Contemporary Mormons' Attitudes Toward Polygamous Practices," Journal of Marriage and Family 25 (May 1963): pp. 167-170)].

Now I don't know about you -- but 40% who said "they would enter the principle if commanded by the prophets" in 1963 is pretty high!

[Paragon Defender]

And YOU are Consumer Reports? ROFL That’s a riot and a half. Thanks for the entertainment! =-)

[Colofornian]

If you are reading this thread and are curious about polygamy and how it related to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, do yourself a favor and understand that most of the posts on this board that could be related to the LDS church in any way are posted and commented on by anti-Mormon activists.

Oh yeah? Yeah!

Well, one of my mentors once relayed to me that, FYI,
#1...the Saints "outlawed" polygamy in the BoM (Book of Jacob) + in the original D&C Sec. 51...
...not to mention the First Manifesto in 1890.

As I seem to recall how one of my mentors put it once in an e-mail to me, this was a bit like Lds leaders conveying to the grass roots folk: "keep what you’ve got but don’t add to your clutch"

Then #2 in the early 1900s, another Smith (I believe it was the grand nephew of the original Joseph) was head of the Lds church and because of all the continuous poly-goings on...like hundreds of additional polygamous unions after 1890, he issued yet a Second Manifesto

Let's see, how did one of my mentors frame that one? Oh, yes; 'twas like the Lds leaders conveying to the Lds grassroots folk: "OK you dimwits ... now we’re getting really serious so you better really stop"

Then #3 this pronouncement was "hierarchy-ally" re- communicated in the 1923 Pronouncement, which my thus-mentioned mentor conveyed was to the grassroots folks as if they were meaning: "you dumb clunks need to realize we were really, really serious this time ... so you are really, really going to have to stop sealing your booties in our temples"

Then #4 -- the enforcement of all previous -- manifesto I (1890), Manifesto II (1903), the pronoucement (1923) -- all "enforced" during the reformation of the 1930s...after all, who could afford more than one wife in the 1930s?

And #5, when the 1945 death of Lds "prophet" Heber Grant occurred...what was the message conveyed to the Lds grassroots from their leadership? Well, as one of my mentors thus framed it: "look you morons ... our last swinger president and prophet has croaked therefore the stuff has really, finally ceased at last!"

(Ya gotta know the "inside insight" of my mentor in figurin' the history behind that comment...that 'twas Grant who began "really" enforcing the polygamous "reformation" in the Lds church...yet the reason why my thus-mentioned "mentor" utilized the word "swinger" was 'cause Grant himself, prior to his reformation emphasis, had been a polygamist!)

Well, if all of the above wasn't enough for you history buffs, then came #6 the 1953 "get a clue" message from the Utah Attorney General’s decision -- after the raid on the twin polygamous communities @ the Utah-AZ border. And the message conveyed there not only to Mormon grassroots but to ALL of us by Utahns in power was: "you imbeciles need to recognize that there is no need to prosecute that stuff any more because it’s ceased to exist - and because it’s so common we couldn’t find a jury to convict and we couldn’t build enough prisons"

So, now to fast-forward all this to the latest mess involving the FLDS. Hmmm...how did one of my mentors frame the message we were ALL getting from Lds, Inc? Oh, yeah: "don’t you idiots realize those clowns are not really Mormons even though they are practicing our faith exactly as proclaimed by Joseph Smith and Brigham Young, and our sacred scriptures still say this is an everlasting covenant necessary to pass into everlasting glory."

Yeah, what a troubling Lds "scripture" that is -- D&C 132. Never rescinded by mainstream Mormons. Still elevated as a "revelation" of God to Joe Smith by contemporary mainstream Mormons. A "Mormon scripture" adhered to by the fLDS but denied by the D&C 132 heretics -- the Mainstream LDS -- yet they don't have the gall to take a pair of scissors & cut it out of their holy book.

So, since I can't frame it any better than how one of my mentors said it in an e-mail to me, allow me to end this post with this private e-mail quote:

"So if plural marriage doesn’t exist,
and never has,
and was only practiced by a select few,
and was only to necessary to provide for excess women in Utah,
and stopped over a hundred years ago,
hasn’t happened for over a hundred years,
and has been condemned by our prophets (even though it is still found in the quad*)
...then why don’t you quit 'persecuting' our righteous brothers and sisters and get a life and move on? So there!"

[Note: 'quad' for you non-Mormon laymen = the 4-pack of Lds "scriptures" of the Book of Mormon, Doctrine & Covenants, Pearl of Great Price, and the Bible...well, and the Bible "insofar as correctly translated" which means if a Mormon disagrees with portions thereof, well that part wasn't "correctly translated."]

You folks all come back now, ya hear?

[Colofornian]

Well, it can’t be YOU. Your white shirts & ties — 52,000 salesmen strong — HAVE to be the used-car salesmen due to the term Lds openly use — proselytize!

[RnMomof7]

Does that extend to divorced mormons that were married in the temple??
Potentially a Mormon could wed and divorce several several women and have many wives in the mormon next life..

I believe it was taught that only those with plural wives could be gods..

[Colofornian]

I believe it was taught that only those with plural wives could be gods..

Yes...for a while there in the 19th century, it was also communicated to men that they wouldn't advance in the leadership ranks unless they had more than one wife and practiced "the principle."

(Oh, how "principled.")

Does that extend to divorced mormons that were married in the temple?? Potentially a Mormon could wed and divorce several several women and have many wives in the mormon next life..

Yes, it does. But there's a catch. He can't just do it "willy-nilly" without his previous wife agreeing to an eternal anullment.

But if you're talking about "death" as being the reason for what precedes a second or third or fourth marriage -- vs. "divorce" -- then it's wide open for future Lds Polygamy in the "afterlife." (Provided they reach the highest degree of glory, that is)

And it's not just men who consecutively marry women; it can be a woman who marries multiple men -- consecutively -- in the temple!

What's surprising to many is that supposedly even that "celestial family" for Mormons today will include polygamy and polyandry!!! (So much for yet additional contemporary disavowing that mainstream Mormons won't be embracing polygamy anytime soon!!! Per Mormon doctrine and polity/policy -- it could be just around the corner for a few Mormons!)

What am I sourcing for this Mormon "top-down" interpretation? Well, a hard to get at "Church Handbook of Instructions" (intended for Lds church bishops) says:

“A living woman may be sealed to only one husband. If she is sealed to a husband and later divorced, she must receive a cancellation of that sealing from the First Presidency before she may be sealed to another man in her lifetime and later: A DECEASED woman may be sealed to ALL men to whom she was legally married during her life.” (p.73) LDS Church, Church Handbook of Instructions, (LDS Church, Salt Lake City, Utah, 1998), page 72-73, “Sealing Policies”)

Therefore, the fact is that from here until Jesus comes, LDS say that a woman is "monogamous." She may be serially monogamous (for earthly time), but she is still monogamous. But...But...we have this little almost asterisk-type polity right over here in the handbook for all Mormon women in good standing who have had more than one husband in their life: "A DECEASED woman may be sealed to ALL men to whom she was legally married during her life."

So a serial monogamous woman on earth has several Mormon forks in the road for celestial eternity according to church practice...why she can either be...
(a) ...Celestial Polyandry Polly...
(b) ...Or, Multiple-Choice Michelle (choosing one husband over another in Kolob Heights)...
(c)... Or Celestial Sally could have had three Mormon husbands -- one at a time...having been sealed to all of them for eternity...while perhaps two of those husbands also took another wife or two.

Could you imagine having these "folks" as your earthly "council of gods"...Sally is married to Ted and also married to Bob and also married to Joseph...and Joseph is married to Fanny and Sally, while Bob was married to Carol on earth, while Ted was also married to Alice! And so the resident "god-'couple'" becomes expanded in the Mormon definition to a Bob & Carol & Ted & Alice & Joseph & Sally & Fanny god-show!

But Sally's the only one who sleeps with all of the male gods!

Boy, it sure gets really interesting in the Mormon afterlife.

Why imagine that...a "goddess" sleeping with all kinds of god-men...kinda reminds you of some Greek mythology. don't it?

[reaganaut]

If you are reading this thread and are curious about polygamy and how it related to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, do yourself a favor and understand that most of the posts on this board that could be related to the LDS church in any way are posted and commented on by anti-Mormon activists.

- - - - - -
PD says that like it is a BAD thing!

Several of us ‘antis’ were at one time faithful, believing members of the Mormon church. We KNOW what it teaches and we have been set free from its clutches.

The ironic thing is that almost all of what we ‘antis’ post are DIRECT QUOTES FROM MORMON SOURCES. Context is checked and quotes verified. Easy peasy to see Mormonism fall when you start to use your BRAIN rather than just your feelings.

To the Lurkers...pray for those trapped in Mormonism, no matter how bleak the fight seems, people are leaving Mormonism in DROVES and many are coming to the true light of Christ. Praise God for that!

[greyfoxx39]

Lurkers, If you are reading this thread and are curious about polygamy and how it related to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints,

Examine this graphic which shows that the polygamist cult FLDS and the Salt Lake City mormon church BOTH originated with Joseph Smith.

[Ruy Dias de Bivar]

**With 4 at-bats per inning... who knows what’s hittable?***

Women to gether have a tendency to naturally adjust their PMS cycles to so all get PMS at the same time.