Posted on 05/13/2008 6:23:31 AM PDT by sevenbak
***I see scripture (the Bible) as a complex intermingling of historical events, laws, fables and parables. Mostly I see scripture as a history of mans attempts to make sense of the world around them, where we came from, what we are, why we are here and what our purpose is. ***
Do you then think that any attributing of any of this to God is lying, colouring of the truth, attempting to gain power over other by appealing to supernatural authority? What is your view of the inclusion and development of God in our Judeo Christian theology?
As for me, I see Scripture as communication from God through the inspiration of men. Men are fallible; there is God’s truth in Scripture that is the truth that He wants us to know; fallible men and fallible translations cloud that. Jesus knew that that would happen and that is why the Church (not any preacher with snake oil, a shingle and a tent) was created by Him, commissioned by the Holy Spirit and set as the theological authority to interpret Scripture.
That authority extends to neither used car salesmen branching out into a more successful field, nor does it extend to renegade Catholic clergy who are irritated at the Church and who wish to attain power and wealth for themselves.
The Scripture right now that you see in e.g. the KJV or the NASB is not the literal truth, yet the literal truth can be interpreted using the Church Fathers going right back to the Apostles. There is a reason that God had the NT written in Greek; it is to the Greeks that we must look for the correct meaning.
Ping to 221.
Any thoughts?
Is it possible not to have any? I respect your belief Mark, and as long as there is a thread that keeps me among the believers, I will certainly defer to the Church, but I am walking a fine line, a tight rope between belief and unbelief.
The tiny thread that keeps me in the realm of believers is simply my own observation that in nature we don't find mercy and therefore it is a mystery and a miracle that we even know what it is. As such, mercy can be said to be "not of this world."
However, the possibility that the source of that mercy may not be God at all is very real. Compare what we know of the world and what our pets know of it. And they will never reach the same level of understanding that we have for it. Just as their world is a microcosm compared to the earth and the Universe around us, so it could be ours compared to another, even greater world whose dimensions and concepts are beyond us, and might as well be God because we will never know what it is.
Without God, our existence seems meaningless. But then meaning is a human construct. So, trying to make sense of incomprehensible is stuffing that which is much bigger than we are into our finite box, and making it "meaningful" but not necessarily more truthful.
I fully agree with LaGrande's opinion when he or she says "I see scripture as a history of mans attempts to make sense of the world around them, where we came from, what we are, why we are here and what our purpose is."
In a 1954 letter recently auctioned for a hefty sum, Albert Einstein says that word God to him is "nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish."
He wrote this a year before he died. Interestingly, in his earlier years he stated "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind," indicating that he has evolved since then in the direction of atheism. Only he knew why, but I am sure Einstein would have a profoundly intelligent reason.
As much as embracing faith is a complete submission, losing it is accepting the famous Hollywood one-liner that "man's gotta have his limitations," which—in so many ways—is an even greater degree of subordination to something we are too small to grasp.
There is a lot to be said why would a loving God make it so difficult and so hazy to see Him if that's what He wants. No doubt, that's what we want. You'd think that persuading someone to follow Him would be a little more cut and dry.
Mercy, charity, and forgiveness are all relatively high level concepts and I agree there may not be any natural examples. If you use the scriptures and ancient texts as examples though, it is easy to see the progression from kill all strangers, to an eye for an eye, to do unto others as you would have them do unto you, to love each other as I have loved you.
The same progression can be seen in science, government, art, etc. I don't see the wild turkeys, practicing calculus. Does that mean that calculus is evidence of God?
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