Southern Baptist leader counters Vatican edict

MSNBC ^ | July 19, 2007

[kawaii]

The only reason I can fathom is because the one undivided church hold to Holy Tradition that the Bible is the Word of God.

Now will you please tell me where you got the Bible if indeed it’s not the one our church put together in the presence of the Holy Spirit?

[DungeonMaster]

The only reason I can fathom is because the one undivided church hold to Holy Tradition that the Bible is the Word of God.

Your kidding!? You've never heard of being born again? You've never heard of faith?

Now will you please tell me where you got the Bible if indeed it’s not the one our church put together in the presence of the Holy Spirit?

The Christian book store.

[kawaii]

Let’s just be honest protestants stole our Holy Book and made up their own religion vagulely related to it’s contents in the 1400s.

[DungeonMaster]

Let’s just be honest protestants stole our Holy Book and made up their own religion vagulely related to it’s contents in the 1400s.

It sounds to me like you believe in man and a well argued man made institution rather than believing in the Lord. If you had gone from being an atheist to a born Again Christian in an instant you might understand faith a little. As it is, the idea didn't even occur to you. I pursued this because I've seen it many times. You like being able to win arguments with 15ish hundred years of rhetoric. Why not go out on faith alone and believe what God says. His Word is all sufficient.

[kawaii]

It sounds to me like you believe in man and a well argued man made institution rather than believing in the Lord.

Actually I beleive the numerous times Christ is quoted as saying in Holy Scripture that he'd send the Holy Spirit to guide his church, and I beleive that the 7 times the WHOLE church came together that Christ made good on what he promised (to say otherwise is calling Christ a liar).

[DungeonMaster]

Actually I beleive the numerous times Christ is quoted as saying in Holy Scripture that he'd send the Holy Spirit to guide his church, and I beleive that the 7 times the WHOLE church came together that Christ made good on what he promised (to say otherwise is calling Christ a liar).

The whole Church came together?

[kawaii]

If you had gone from being an atheist to a born Again Christian in an instant you might understand faith a little. As it is, the idea didn't even occur to you.

So going from athiest to 'some faith' is some sort of qualifier? Folks go from being athiests to Mormon, or Muslim, or any numbher of other faiths every day that doesn't mean that the 'faith' they latched onto is true.

[kawaii]

The whole Church came together?

In 7 ecumenical councils, yes.

[kawaii]

Why not go out on faith alone and believe what God says. His Word is all sufficient.

Because for hundreds of years Christians didn't even HAVE the written word all they HAD was the CHURCH DEFENDING THE FAITH. They didn't need to turn the faith Christ and the apostles claimed into a singing and reading group, and they got together to WORSHIP him AS HE COMMANDED. Running around proclaiming scripture alone, is in opposition to the faith.

[DungeonMaster]

So going from athiest to 'some faith' is some sort of qualifier? Folks go from being athiests to Mormon, or Muslim, or any numbher of other faiths every day that doesn't mean that the 'faith' they latched onto is true.

Faith is the only qualifier. Being a member of the denomination with the best arguments is a trap.

[DungeonMaster]

In 7 ecumenical councils, yes.

That's not the whole church.

[tiki]

Actually that is a very good question. Why WOULD anyone believe anything the Bible says? Please tell me why Christians accept the Bible as the inerrant Word of God.

[DungeonMaster]

Actually that is a very good question. Why WOULD anyone believe anything the Bible says? Please tell me why Christians accept the Bible as the inerrant Word of God.

By faith.

[wmfights]

Maybe it's because other groups adhere to the bible and the actual definition of church.

I believe the key here is the Bible. We do not place anything as a co-equal to it and all doctrine must be justified by it.

[Running On Empty]

Mind-reading

[tiki]

Whose faith? The faith of Muslims, Jews, Buddhists, Hindus...? The faith of Tom, Dick and Harry? Martin Luther, John Knox, Calvin? Your individual faith? Do you accept the Bible because your church believes it is the inerrant Word of God? Your minister? Your parents?

Who canonized the Scripture? Who had/has the authority to proclaim the Scripture as the inerrant Word of God? Who gave them that authority? By whose authority do you accept the Bible? Were the Books of the NT the only Christian writings throughout early Christian history? How do we even know that any letter of Paul's was actually from Paul?

These are serious questions. To accept the Bible there has to be an origin and people under the influence of the Holy Spirit who were able to certify that it was the authentic Word of God.

[Rightly Biased]

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[DungeonMaster]

Whose faith? The faith of Muslims, Jews, Buddhists, Hindus...? The faith of Tom, Dick and Harry? Martin Luther, John Knox, Calvin? Your individual faith? Do you accept the Bible because your church believes it is the inerrant Word of God? Your minister? Your parents?

Who canonized the Scripture? Who had/has the authority to proclaim the Scripture as the inerrant Word of God? Who gave them that authority? By whose authority do you accept the Bible? Were the Books of the NT the only Christian writings throughout early Christian history? How do we even know that any letter of Paul's was actually from Paul?

These are serious questions. To accept the Bible there has to be an origin and people under the influence of the Holy Spirit who were able to certify that it was the authentic Word of God.

I find it interesting and frustrating that you explode upon hearing the word "faith". By your answer it is obvious that you really are confused by this word.

[kosta50]

We would have considered it disruptive for a woman to wear a veil and hats were considered vanities. The issue was modesty and being humble - and, I suspect, a tincture of the results of poverty and a good dash of making sure that they did not look at all like the Catholics

What is disruptive or vain about these Eastern Orthodox women? Nothing.

People coming dressed in provocative clothing to church, as I have seen in some Protestant churches, is disruptive. Also people dressed like they are going to the beach is diruptive. Vanity is disruptive, and can be extended to makeup for women and hair dies as well. Is overdressing for church not vain and disruptive?

You theory that something has been going on between St. Paul and the Corinthians is as extra-biblical as it gets. You are now using the same arguments you argue against.

People who believe that Jonah lived in an acid-filled stomach deptived of oxygen and subject to smooth muscle crushing contractions for three days and somehow lived -- because it's in the Bible and God said so -- all of a sudden just "can't understand" the completely unumbiguos commandment of an Apostle in the New Testament as something coming from God that (short-haired) women should be covered in hurch.

[kawaii]

if one is separated in theology and doctrine one does not have the same FAITH. they beleive SOMETHING but what they beleive isn’t the same faith as the FAITH Christ gave us.