More Evidence Pius XII Was Not Hitler's Pope - German Files Point to a Russian Plot

Zenit News Agency ^ | April 2, 2007

[Petronski]

No --- he was tenuously in power at that time and in dire need of a Concordat to keep him there.

By July 1933, all other political parties in Germany had been banned and the Enabling Act (the Ermächtigungsgesetz) had been approved by the rump Reichstag, giving Hitler dictatorial powers.

You have no idea what you're talking about.

[Petronski]

Pacelli's Vatican was willing to secure the devil in power...

The devil Corporal already held all the power...all that remained was the death of Hindenberg, and the Gleischaltung. Indeed, by July 1933 the brownshirts had been deputized as law enforcement officers.

[Uncle Chip]

And running rat lines for Nazi war criminals: Was that the calling of the Roman Catholic Church or just a special dispensation in Pius XII’s Vatican?

[Petronski]

Your understanding of the period is demonstrably deficient (to be polite). You have no credibility on this topic.

[trisham]

According to the newly discovered documents, Pius XII was considered an enemy of the Third Reich. Memos and letters unearthed at a depot used by the Stasi, the East German secret police, show that Nazi spies within the Vatican were concerned at the Pope's efforts to help displaced Poles and Jews.

One document from the head of Berlin's police force tells Joachim von Ribbentrop, the Third Reich's foreign minister, that the Catholic Church was providing assistance to Jews "both in terms of people and financially."

*************

It makes perfect sense.

[Uncle Chip]

By July 1933, all other political parties in Germany had been banned and the Enabling Act (the Ermächtigungsgesetz) had been approved by the rump Reichstag, giving Hitler dictatorial powers.

The signing of the Concordat was a mere formality of a deal that had been made earlier. But you know that.

[Petronski]

And that guarantee was at whose expense???

No one.

At the expense of other people's religion, their freedom and their lives???

No.

Your prelates were willing to sell others down the pike so that they could continue on unmolested???

No.

And you think that God was pleased with this sell-out???

There was no sell out.

Oh, and Pius XII saved 860,000 Jews from the Holocaust.

[Petronski]

It did not bring Hitler to power, but you knew that.

[Uncle Chip]

Can you explain ‘just war’ and justice from a New Testament standpoint with footnotes please?

Can you post a list of websites that document the atrocities of the Vatican-supported Ustasha against the Serbs during World War II, and then I'll get busy on it.

[kawaii]

You suggested that there was a plan to bring some people to justice, do you care to back up that claim with scripture, or are you fine to abandon Christianity for this thread?

[Petronski]

The signing of the Concordat was a mere formality of a deal that had been made earlier.

Von Papen had no discussions with the Vatican until April 1933, again, after the Enabling Act.

[kawaii]

btw I’d suggest you look at the Ustasha-Islam connection.

[AnAmericanMother]

Really you have lost any credibility you ever had on this topic -- your screeds are totally unfounded in fact.

The Concordat was at nobody else's expense, it applied only to Catholics, who were being persecuted. The Church was trying to save its own members. Other Churches tried to save their own members -- by far more unpalatable methods such as joining the German National Church and putting Hitler's picture in the sanctuary. I suppose one might argue that the Catholics by dealing with Hitler at all gave him some measure of credibility -- but Britain, France, and Italy had already done that.

Was your denomination in Germany? If so, what were they doing to oppose Hitler (and no fair weaseling by saying that American members of your denomination eventually wound up over there fighting after 1942. So did my Dad.)

[Titanites]

Again, what specific action did your specific church and your specific church leaders take to save the Jews from the Holocaust? Let's hear it.

That you can't provide an answer says it all.

[trisham]

bookmark

[Uncle Chip]

Oh, and Pius XII saved 860,000 Jews from the Holocaust.

But only if they converted to Catholicism, right? And just how many Orthodox Serbs did he save from his own archbishop's Ustasha?

[Campion]

It sent soldiers to fight against the Third Reich

He asked about your church, not your country, unless you're prepared to tell us that your church had its own army.

Falsely accusing others, and then being evasive when a direct question is asked of you, isn't very becoming Christian behavior.

[Uncle Chip]

I answered yours. Did you answer mine????

[AnAmericanMother]

The signing of the Concordat was a mere formality of a deal that had been made earlier. But you know that.

Are you making this stuff up as you go along?

v.Papen didn't even start negotiations on a concordat until April. He was sent by Hitler pursuant to his dictatorial powers under the enabling legislation.

[Campion]

But only if they converted to Catholicism, right?

Sorry, but that's not true.

Is the commandment against bearing false witness missing from your Bible?