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The Doctrine of Purgatory
http://www.therealpresence.org/archives/Eschatology/Eschatology_006.htm ^ | Unknown | Fr. John A. Hardon, S.J

Posted on 01/29/2007 6:45:51 AM PST by stfassisi

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To: ArrogantBustard

"Further discussion should probably go off thread."

No, please keep it on thread.
It is a relief to see you guys not taking yourselves so seriously.

Remember Friar Tuck's soliloquy on beer in Robin Hood.\

The the Trappists who make the Belgian ale will thank you, because they, of course, can't talk about their product themselves.

Jesus' first miracle was to make alcohol.
And one of his last was to make wine his blood.

Alcohol is good.


461 posted on 01/30/2007 8:48:48 AM PST by Vicomte13 (Et alors?)
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To: Vicomte13

BTW,

All those "shrines" operated by the RCC are nothing more than religious amusement parks designed to generate revenue from the gullible faithful (The RCC term "faithful" translates to "deceived" for us Christian).


462 posted on 01/30/2007 8:49:35 AM PST by pjr12345
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To: Vicomte13

I must have missed it. what post?


463 posted on 01/30/2007 8:49:45 AM PST by bornacatholic
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To: pjr12345

"I have the PC Study Bible from Biblesoft (www.biblesoft.com). I highly recommend it!"

Interesting.
Does this let you do a quick cross-compare of translations?
And quick cross-references?
I do everything by hand, and it's wretchedly slow and 19th Century.


464 posted on 01/30/2007 8:50:03 AM PST by Vicomte13 (Et alors?)
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To: bornacatholic

Are you an ordained member of the clergy?


465 posted on 01/30/2007 8:50:41 AM PST by Vicomte13 (Et alors?)
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To: Vicomte13
IS IT an abomination? Is Satan healing people at Lourdes? Or do you need to rethink your view of Mary?

Benny Hinn "heals" people, too. Maybe the RCC ought to erect a shrine to him!

466 posted on 01/30/2007 8:50:55 AM PST by pjr12345
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To: Vicomte13

no


467 posted on 01/30/2007 8:51:26 AM PST by bornacatholic
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To: pjr12345

Who is healing the people at Lourdes?


468 posted on 01/30/2007 8:51:36 AM PST by Vicomte13 (Et alors?)
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To: pjr12345
The list seems to grow each day!

It's very interesting that the driving force of it's growth is often popular demand. "Co-redeemer" is almost official due to demand.

469 posted on 01/30/2007 8:54:42 AM PST by DungeonMaster (Acts 17:11 also known as sola scriptura.)
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To: DungeonMaster

...."mother of my Lord. That's about it."

That's the very pinnacle of holiness and Emmmauel ("God with us") as one can be. And she was chosen for this out of all human beings and out of all time.

That's about it, all right.


470 posted on 01/30/2007 8:56:21 AM PST by Running On Empty
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To: Vicomte13
Jesus said that Leviticus and Deuteronomy were wrong about divorce and food rules.

No he didn't. Here's what he said in Matthew 15:

10 When He had called the multitude to Himself, He said to them, “Hear and understand: 11 Not what goes into the mouth defiles a man; but what comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.”

He isn't challenging Scripture. He is simply saying that the food isn't the problem, but the tongues of men.

In fact, he stated earlier in Matthew 5:

17 Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill.

Does this sound like he is contradicting Scripture? I think not! Your assertion is plain wrong.

471 posted on 01/30/2007 8:57:01 AM PST by pjr12345
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To: Running On Empty

The Lord is Awesome, no doubt about it. But the bible doesn't do the transfer that the RCC seems to insist upon doing.


472 posted on 01/30/2007 8:59:21 AM PST by DungeonMaster (Acts 17:11 also known as sola scriptura.)
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To: Vicomte13

You really should look into some of the software available. There are a few choices. There are a few online ("free") resources, but nothing beats having your software on your own PC with lots of resources at your finger-tips.

And yes, you can cross-reference almost anything in almost any way.

The price is pretty good, too.


473 posted on 01/30/2007 9:00:17 AM PST by pjr12345
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To: Vicomte13

The same one who is healing people at Benny Hinn services!


474 posted on 01/30/2007 9:01:51 AM PST by pjr12345
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To: Vicomte13
vicomte....We don't need a Church Council to explain, JESUS explained it, by using the Jewish term and not explaining it or modifying it for his Jewish audience. He knew what they thought Gehenna was - Christian Hell AND Purgatory, all at once - and he used that word, and just that word, as an image.

*Balderdash.

Aquinas....

I answer that, Even as in bodies there is gravity or levity whereby they are borne to their own place which is the end of their movement, so in souls there is merit or demerit whereby they reach their reward or punishment, which are the ends of their deeds. Wherefore just as a body is conveyed at once to its place, by its gravity or levity, unless there be an obstacle, so too the soul, the bonds of the flesh being broken, whereby it was detained in the state of the way, receives at once its reward or punishment, unless there be an obstacle. Thus sometimes venial sin, though needing first of all to be cleansed, is an obstacle to the receiving of the reward; the result being that the reward is delayed. And since a place is assigned to souls in keeping with their reward or punishment, as soon as the soul is set free from the body it is either plunged into hell or soars to heaven, unless it be held back by some debt, for which its flight must needs be delayed until the soul is first of all cleansed. This truth is attested by the manifest authority of the canonical Scriptures and the doctrine of the holy Fathers; wherefore the contrary must be judged heretical as stated in Dial. iv, 25, and in De Eccl. Dogm. xlvi.

*Hell and purgatory are not the same

475 posted on 01/30/2007 9:01:58 AM PST by bornacatholic
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To: DungeonMaster

Poll-driven religion!


476 posted on 01/30/2007 9:02:29 AM PST by pjr12345
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To: murphE; Vicomte13; kawaii
I've got two requests to keep the beer discussion on thread, so rescind my suggestion of taking it off line.

L'chaim!!!

477 posted on 01/30/2007 9:02:33 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilisation is aborting, buggering, and contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: pjr12345

How do you know this for certain truth?

Please prove your position.


478 posted on 01/30/2007 9:04:22 AM PST by Running On Empty
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To: Vicomte13; pjr12345; Dr. Eckleburg; blue-duncan; Gamecock; xzins
Who is healing the people at Lourdes?

Katheryn Kuhlman.

"But hidden underneath the 1945 Shirley Temple hairdo is one of the most remarkable Christian charismatics in the U.S. She is, in fact, a veritable one-woman shrine of Lourdes." Time Magazine September 14, 1970.

479 posted on 01/30/2007 9:04:47 AM PST by P-Marlowe (What happened to my tagline?)
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To: DungeonMaster

What transfer are you referring to?


480 posted on 01/30/2007 9:05:18 AM PST by Running On Empty
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