Posted on 01/24/2007 8:41:04 AM PST by Joseph DeMaistre
No one is contending that.
Protestants contend that the church of Rome has erred substantially. The Reformation was a call to return to orthodoxy and God's word.
In what passage?
To set people up with a theology which is necessary for salvation, but to leave it in the hands of people you know will manipulate it and use it to deceive, is deceptive. You not only allow the deception to occur, you enable it, by giving to those you know will deceive with it.
Not to mention it is extremely unjust and unmerciful. Both of which are impossible for God.
But you started this, Joseph.
It is fine to post what you posted on a Protestant Catholic-bash thread (to the extent there are any).
Even then, you represent Rome, so you should be temperate.
You started this thread not just to teach, but to provoke and to bash.
There are times to bash. I just bashed Pope Leo X and Luther both, in another post, because they both ordered men's torture and death - murderous bigots, the lot of them.
But to START a thread to bash Protestants...well...that may not be against the rules, but it's certainly not the sort of thing that will bring Protestants and Catholics closer. And as Romans, we are obliged to do that. We have the Truth, entrusted to us. We have to persuade, FIRST by what we DO - our fruits, then by how we act, and then by what we say.
If there are Catholic bashers, go hammer and tongs after them, in THEIR lair, of THEIR making. But WE should not be starting wars.
Sola Scriptura is wrong?
Well, maybe.
The Scripture is the inspired Word of God, and Catholic teaching is all in there.
The problem with Sola Scriptura is that every man reads text a little differently, and the unity of Christendom for which Christ prayed is lost...
...or IS IT?
Would Christendom really have fallen apart? Would Luther have LEFT the Church? had the response of the papacy and the cardinals been to argue and persuade, instead of to command, to threaten, to sadistically torture and to commit mass murder? The acts of the Church made the Church evil, and made Luther right to separate from it.
Good doctrine is not enough if the fruit is poison.
That was then.
This is now.
Now, nobody in the West is torturing and killing anybody else over Christian doctrine. So, inflaming passions and dividing Christians over ancient arguments of very bad people is itself a bad thing.
Truth is, it doesn't matter. Sola Scriptura or Ave Maria does not matter. Do they love God with all their heart, soul and mind? Do they feed the hungry, care for the poor, care for the ill? Are they peacemakers? Then that is enough, at least from the perspective of a Catholic.
Moreover, nobody is ever convinced by the sort of attack you sent along.
As I said and will repeat: it is well to defend, point by point, Catholic doctrine using Scripture. It is well to prove the point.
It is not well to START the fight.
The fight accomplishes nothing but bitterness.
Catholics have to love Calvinists, and vice versa, even if each is sure the other is cracked in the head.
Do otherwise, and Jesus will crack both heads soon enough in Gehenna.
It is the whole truth, not a half truth. It was the Sacred Books that were approved one needed permission to read, or it was a criminal act according to the Council of Trent. Eckleburg posted the decree.
Don't have a Bible handy at the moment.
I'll look it up when I get home and post it.
Gehinnom is Jewish Purgatory/Hell.
This may interest you:
PROVIDENTISSIMUS DEUS
ENCYCLICAL OF POPE LEO XIII
ON THE STUDY OF HOLY SCRIPTURE
Holy Scripture Most Profitable To Doctrine and Morality
3. Among the reasons for which the Holy Scripture is so worthy of commendation - in addition to its own excellence and to the homage which we owe to God's Word - the chief of all is, the innumerable benefits of which it is the source; according to the infallible testimony of the Holy Ghost Himself, who says: "All Scripture, inspired of God, is profitable to teach, to reprove, to correct, to instruct in justice, that the man of God may be perfect, furnished to every good work."(6) That such was the purpose of God in giving the Scripture of men is shown by the example of Christ our Lord and of His Apostles. For He Himself Who "obtained authority by miracles, merited belief by authority, and by belief drew to Himself the multitude"(7) was accustomed in the exercise of His Divine Mission, to appeal to the Scriptures. He uses them at times to prove that He is sent by God, and is God Himself. From them He cites instructions for His disciples and confirmation of His doctrine. He vindicates them from the calumnies of objectors; he quotes them against Sadducees and Pharisees, and retorts from them upon Satan himself when he dares to tempt Him. At the close of His life His utterances are from Holy Scripture, and it is the Scripture that He expounds to His disciples after His resurrection, until He ascends to the glory of His Father. Faithful to His precepts, the Apostles, although He Himself granted "signs and wonders to be done by their hands"(8) nevertheless used with the greatest effect the sacred writings, in order to persuade the nations everywhere of the wisdom of Christianity, to conquer the obstinacy of the Jews, and to suppress the outbreak of heresy. This is plainly seen in their discourses, especially in those of St. Peter: these were often little less than a series of citations from the Old Testament supporting in the strongest manner the new dispensation. We find the same thing in the Gospels of St. Matthew and St. John and in the Catholic Epistles; and most remarkably of all in the words of him who "boasts that he learned the law at the feet of Gamaliel, in order that, being armed with spiritual weapons, he might afterwards say with confidence, `The arms of our warfare are not carnal but mighty unto God.' "(9) Let all, therefore, especially the novices of the ecclesiastical army, understand how deeply the sacred Books should be esteemed, and with what eagerness and reverence they should approach this great arsenal of heavenly arms. For those whose duty it is to handle Catholic doctrine before the learned or the unlearned will nowhere find more ample matter or more abundant exhortation, whether on the subject of God, the supreme Good and the all-perfect Being, or of the works which display His Glory and His love. Nowhere is there anything more full or more express on the subject of the Saviour of the world than is to be found in the whole range of the Bible. As St. Jerome says, "To be ignorant of the Scripture is not to know Christ."(10) In its pages His Image stands out, living and breathing; diffusing everywhere around consolation in trouble, encouragement to virtue and attraction to the love of God. And as to the Church, her institutions, her nature, her office, and her gifts, we find in Holy Scripture so many references and so many ready and convincing arguments, that as St. Jerome again most truly says: "A man who is well grounded in the testimonies of the Scripture is the bulwark of the Church."(11)And if we come to morality and discipline, an apostolic man finds in the sacred writings abundant and excellent assistance; most holy precepts, gentle and strong exhortation, splendid examples of every virtue, and finally the promise of eternal reward and the threat of eternal punishment, uttered in terms of solemn import, in God's name and in God's own words.
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/leo_xiii/encyclicals/documents/hf_l-xiii_enc_18111893_providentissimus-deus_en.html
Peace be with you and may God bless you all, especially on this the Feast of the Conversion of Saint Paul
Keeping a race enslaved is not the same as manipulating the word of God. Especially after that Word came and promised that the gates of Hell would not prevail against His Church. God did provide a way, and always has and always will.
(((shudder)))
What travesty will they think of next?!?
Or should I have said...
"Quis eo mos adveho tunc??"
Did this overturn the license requirements of Trent?
There weren't any radical differences other than the language?
I know that the Approcypha was not included and Luther didn't want to include the book of James, but ultimately it was included. What would the objection be to people having their own Bibles?
Amen.
"When I was in High School some of my Catholic friends told me that they needed to get permission from the priest before they could read the bible on their own"
Yeah, but that was before electricity and the priest was probably trying to conserve the oil for the lanterns.
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