Seminary leaders cite distinction between belief and advocacy (Tounges)

SBTexan ^ | October 23, 2006 | Tammi Reed Ledbetter,

[Quix]

Not sure about THE point but I got lots of good points!

Much appreciate your efforts.

Are you on my ping list? I forget. You might appreciate these threads:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1733999/posts

and:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1734008/posts

[editor-surveyor]

"Looks like I messed up on my HTML somewhere..."

Not too sure about that, try a google of  and see what comes up.

[editor-surveyor]

Are you using an Open Office editor for html?

[.30Carbine]

Thank you, RB, for praying and for posting and for pinging me. That's ministry.

[Rightly Biased]

Outlook express has an editor.

I guess it needs an update.

oh well.

RB<><

[editor-surveyor]

On google I found almost a million sites that used the same coding as your post did, and they displayed correctly. It might be a freerepublic quirk.

[Alamo-Girl]

Are you familiar with any verses that say that the Bible saves us?

No. In various passages, it is said that the Scriptures "speak" or "say" - but Jesus makes the distinction here:

Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God. - Matt 22:29

The Scriptures are just text on paper like any ancient manuscript to those who do not know the "power of God." Likewise, all the eloquent sermons and jaw-dropping reasoning in the world will not help one who does not have "ears to hear."

And yet there are people I suspect who truly believe that the only way a person can be saved is by physically hearing the words of God, deaf persons notwithstanding:

So then faith [cometh] by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. - Romans 10:27

Thus, it appears some confuse The Word of God with the media by which Jesus is heard:

My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: - John 10:27

In the above, the hearers were literally hearing the sounds, the pressure waves of Christ speaking. Others may hear Christ by reading the Scriptures. Still others may hear Christ by words spoken by a mentor (as it was in the days of Paul, Peter, John, etc. and perhaps today by a gifted evangelist or preacher who presents the words of God with power)

But it is not the physical media that matters, but the voice of Christ Himself because He is the power of God, The Word of God (John 1, Rev 19):

Why do ye not understand my speech? [even] because ye cannot hear my word. - John 8:43

The ones to whom Christ was speaking in the above passage were physically hearing Him, i.e. their ears were registering the pressure waves and their minds were processing the information. But they were not spiritually hearing Him.

And Moses called unto all Israel, and said unto them, Ye have seen all that the LORD did before your eyes in the land of Egypt unto Pharaoh, and unto all his servants, and unto all his land; The great temptations which thine eyes have seen, the signs, and those great miracles: Yet the LORD hath not given you an heart to perceive, and eyes to see, and ears to hear, unto this day. - Deu 29:2-4

So to return to your question, no the Scriptures do not save anyone nor does the speaking the words of God even by The Word of God Himself, Jesus Christ. And Christ only saves those who have "ears to hear."

No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. - John 6:44

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. - John 14:6

Salvation is a gift of God. It cannot be earned. It cannot be learned. I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness [come] by the law, then Christ is dead in vain. - Gal 2:21

For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. - I Cor 1:21

[Alamo-Girl]

I hope you do not mind, but I took the liberty of reformatting your outstanding post to make it easier to read (below.) Hopefully others here will meditate on your insights and realize that what so often stands between where we are and the abundant life is that tendency to quench the Spirit by being unwilling to "let go" and "let God." Those who have are never troubled by mortal life - including a change of fortune like yesterday's election results. (Philippians 4:6-7)

UNDERSTAND THAT GOD COMMANDS ALL CHRISTIANS TO BE FILLED WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT.

Ephesians 5:18 “Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery. Instead, be filled with the Spirit.”

Can you imagine a verse more contemporary than this?

We live in a day when people of all ages, background and economy are seeking ecstasy and escapism through the outward stimuli of drugs and alcohol. Paul says that these things are cheap substitutes for real meaning in life. Being filled with the Holy Spirit is a natural high and it is God’s Command!

4 Spiritual Lessons From This Verse:

1.) This is imperative: Living the Spirit-filled life is not optional for the Christian. This is God’s expressed command for everyone of His children, and this includes me!

2.) This vers is in the present tense, meaning that the filling of the Holy Spirit is an experience that is continual. Filling should take place daily or moment by moment.

3.) This verse is plural in number, which means that it applies to all Christians, not just a select few.

4.) This verse is passive in voice, stating that the filling of the Holy Spirit is something that God does to us and for us, not something we do for ourselves. This command is for every believer, not for an elite group.

UNDERSTAND THERE ARE REASONS SOME DO NOT EXPERIENCE THE CONTINUAL FILLING OF THE HOLY SPIRIT.

1.) Lack of Information - many Christians are ignorant as to what the Bible promises concerning the Spirit filled life.

2.) Misinformation

a.) Some think that the infilling of the Holy Spirit is for great saints. This is not true. The promise and the command are universal for Christians.

b.) Some feel that unless the infilling of the Holy Spirit is accompanied by ecstatic utterances, or glossolilia (speaking in tongues), one has not received the Holy Spirit. This is absolutely and unbiblical teaching that Satan has used to divide the church. Many great Christians do not speak, and have never spoken in tongues. This gift was given for the expressed purpose of evangelism and those who teach differently are either unschooled on doctrinal interpretation or purposely deceptive.

c.) Some feel that the Holy Spirit is sent upon us and removed from us by God as He sees fit. This also, is not true. It was true in the Old Testament times, but after Pentecost, God’s Spirit comes into the life of everyone who is saved at the moment of their salvation, and God’s promise is that He will never leave us.

d.) Some say, if you don’t feel God’s Spirit, He must not be present. This also is not true. The presence of the Holy Spirit in our lives is not dependent upon our emotion, it is dependent upon God’s promises.

3.) Lack of Concern – many times Christians get busy with good things and forget the most important thing. This is when we get our priorities mixed up, and we began to quench the Holy Spirit. The quenching on the Holy Spirit should not be confused with losing the Holy Spirit, but when we quench the Holy Spirit, there is not a continuing filling.

HOW TO INSURE THE CONTINUING FILLING OF GOD’S SPIRIT IN YOUR LIFE

1.) Recognize That the Holy Spirit Lives Within You

Romans 8:9 11 You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. [10] But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness. [11] And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives in you.

When you were saved, God took up residence in your life!

2.) Realize That it Is God’s Will for You to Be Continually Filled with His Spirit.

Ephes. 5:18b ......be filled with the Spirit.“

You will never have more of God than you desire. You must desire to be continually filled with His Spirit and you must live a life that demonstrates that desire.

3.) Confess Every Sin.

1 John 1:9 “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.”

4.) Abandon Your Will to God’s

Galatians 2:20 “I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.”

Trusting one’s life to God’s will is absolutely essential to living the Spirit controlled life.

5.) Walk in Faith

Luke 11:13 “If you then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to those who ask him!"

Why is it that we trust God with our eternity, but not with our today or tomorrow?

Remember we are to walk in faith, and not by feelings.

Galatians 3:14 “He redeemed us in order that the blessing given to Abraham might come to the Gentiles through Christ Jesus, so that by faith we might receive the promise of the Spirit.”

The gift of salvation is wonderful, but you will never become all that God intends for you to become without being continually filled with His Spirit.

You will never be the witness that God intends for you to be unless you are living a Spirit controlled life every day.

Regards RB

[Rightly Biased]

Thanks Alamo-Girl


I don't mind at all I have no idea what I did wrong.

God Bless you for your effort.


RB<><

[jo kus]

I agree with everything you said regarding hearing the Word of God and that the Bible does not save - it is merely a medium that God uses to reach us.

God is not restricted and can reach us in many ways besides the Bible.

Regards

[jkl1122]

While I don't disagree that God is not restricted, the only way to salvation starts by hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17).

[jo kus]

While I don't disagree that God is not restricted, the only way to salvation starts by hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17).

That "Word of God", however, is not restricted to the Bible. Remember, Paul says that even the Gentiles possessed a law written on their hearts, even though they didn't have the written law. Thus, the Spirit is able to "speak" to even the pagans. However, this does not do away with the Church. This merely means that God can prepare man to receive the fullness of the Gospel, or He can give "enough" grace to the man whom He sees will not ever hear the formal Word of God as preached by a missionary - for example, those who live from faith to faith in God and were an Incan Indian living in 1200 AD - before Catholic missionaries ever reached them.

Regards