Posted on 05/30/2006 8:13:52 AM PDT by x5452
A perspective worth hearing if nothing else...
It's an odd view considering that Dan Brown's later book, Angels and Demons, takes on the Masons. He is allegedly working on a Mormon book next.
The Russian church does have something of a penchant for blaming the masons first...
It'll be interesting to see how the masons are painted in Browns book.
One point of contention between the masons and the Russian church though is that the Russian church does not neccessarily beleive in the sort of strict secular state which masonry strongly advocates...
Its for this reason there are religion classes in many Russian public schools
Bet he doesn't touch Islam.
Such courage.....not.
How many Masons are in D.C. working very dilligently to marginalize our constitution?
How many Masons were involved in it's conception?
Yeah. I guess that answers the question. There was a high percentage then, so it only figures there'd be a high percentage now...
OF course not. Some things are sacred after all.
The Roman Church does as well. To join the Freemasons is automatic excommunication for us Catholics
Of note though is that many bishops and priests in both churches were or aledgedly were including some canonized folks (though largely martyrs)
"How many Masons are in D.C. working very dilligently to marginalize our constitution?"
You mean, besides the freemasons that wrote it and signed it?
(If you did not know, basically all the founders of the United States, from Paul Revere, to George Washington and Ben Franklin were Freemasons. Indeed, but it was Washington's and Franklin's Freemason connections that secured arms and equipment for the revolution.)
"To join the Freemasons is automatic excommunication for us Catholics"
Curious point here: Berlisconi (former Italian Prime Minister) was a well-known Freemason. Indeed, he got in trouble for not disclosing it and being a government employee (law relating back to anti-fascist regulations -- had to disclose memberships).
Anyway, he remained a mason to this day.
And was a good acquantance with Pope JP -and- repeatedly received communion directly from the Pope.
Methinks it is not as big an issue as the RCC crowd on FR seems to think it is.
Thanks for the reminder. Knew I had read about quite a few, and there were many reservations about having that kind of thing. But, if I remember correctly, there weren't any other options...
"there were many reservations about having that kind of thing."
No, not really. For a long time, being a freemason was seen as a patriotic duty.
I do realize that because Washington's remarks were along those lines. At the time I first read about the Freemasons, I wondered why there was such reluctance to involve them in things. However, there was an uneasiness in the way Washington said things about the Masons, as if those kind of people could easily lose their sense of self-discipline, even though, as you stated, being a Freemason was a patriotic duty. It just didn't all come together until becoming aware of the disarray in D.C. Today, I think we are seeing what Washington feared most...
Then that was a failure on Pope John Paul II's part in taking diplomacy over Church law.
The Code of Canon Law of 1917 specifically named the Masons as a forbidden organization. In 1983 when it was rewritten their name was ommitted and instead chose to mention all "forbidden organizations." (1374)
For clarification people went to the Congregation for the Doctrine that same year. Dotrina (I believe it was our current pope at the time) stated that the change was not to allow membership in the Freemasons but to broaden it for organizations such as Catholics for Free Choice.
Freemasonry has always been visciously anti-Catholic, and that hasn't really changed. Their core beliefs such as realtivism and human perfection are totally incompatable with Catholocism. This has always been the case and isn't likely to change.
Membership in the Freemasons remains forbidden for Catholics.
"Their core beliefs such as realtivism and human perfection are totally incompatable with Catholocism."
What a strawman. Those are not remotely the "core beliefs" (or any beliefs) of the fraternity. Like the Boy Scouts (another masonic-founded fraternity), Masons do strive to become better men, but are taught that acceptability to God is only possible through the will of God and the sacrifice of the Lion of Judah.
Or so says the prayer at the end of every meeting.
The real historical reasons for the problems with the fraternity are four-fold:
(1) it was historically largely a protestant fraternity and encouraged the questioning of authority when authority seemed out of bounds (for example, certain freemasons were key in getting William Tyndale's english translation of the Bible printed);
(2) the underlying organization was a trade union of stone masons, the major customers being the nobility and the church (with the resulting financial tension and various lords pressuring the RCC into stomping them) and
(3) the portion of the Knight's Templar that fled to Scotland formed the core of the York Rite body.
(Just FYI on this: the Knights went at least three ways on that Friday the 13th when the weak France-based pope very reluctantly caved to the corrupt French king who owed the knights money -- long story of a known fake confession under torture that even the RCC admits was a terrible mistake) --- one group went to what is now Switzerland; one stayed in place and changed its name to "Knights of Christ"); and the third part, the fleet, sailed from France that day to Scotland, the populous of which had been excommunicated for various political reasons and joined with the revolutionary rable --- the minor nobles of which were freemasons.
Regardless of the merits of the original charges, no one takes it seriously nowadays, other than the people here at FR.
I think the current-day confusion still stems from the nonsense started with the Protocols of the Elders of Zion -- like the claim that Jews use blood of gentile children for Passover, the garbage in the Protocols (so oft repeated here on FR) about freemasons is equally bogus.
[b]Regardless of the merits of the original charges, no one takes it seriously nowadays, other than the people here at FR. [/b]
No one except the people here at FR...
And our current Pope....
And the apologetics/experts on EWTN....
And Cardinal Bernard Law....
And the 1980 Conference of Bishops....
And the Code of Canon Law....
And the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith....
But otherwise, yeah, its just Catholics on here who think that way. :)
The local bishop here certainly doesn't care.
Half our members are RC, and the KOC meet in a mason lodge because they lost their lease.
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