Billy Graham's Disobedience to the Word of God

Way of Life ^ | Not sure | David Cloud

[Sensei Ern]

While I believe the assertions are true, because I have heard them from BG's own mouth on various TV appearances, David Cloud is a man I put no creedance in. The man only knows how to criticize.

David should spend more time leading people to Christ. The Holy Spirit directs us away from false teachers. The main thing his "ministry" is doing is giving fodder to those who oppose Christianity to attack us with.

Billy Grham is near his deathbed. Besides CLoud attacking Graham is like a mosquito attacking a horse...you might get an irritating bump, but you ignore it.

[xzins]

“Graham said... ‘Finally, the way of salvation has not changed.

I agree with Graham on this. The way of salvation has not changed.

Do you believe it has?

[steve-b]

At least we can disagree without slicing heads off.

The author of this moonbat screech sounds like somebody who would slice heads off if he thought he could get away with it.

[Sensei Ern]

I stopped listening to BG after he encouraged people to return to churches they had atteneded for years on end and never heard the Gospel.

However, David Cloud is the Ross Perot of Christianity.

[Alamo-Girl]

My "two cents" (not that anyone asked for them):

Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. - Matthew 7:1-2

The ones judging Billy Graham will themselves be judged by the measure they have used on Billy Graham (et al).

Conversely, Billy Graham will be judged by the measure he has used on others (virtually non-existent).

Personally, I cannot afford the luxury of being judgmental, harboring resentments and the ilk.

[steve-b]

The author's theology boils down to: "Jesus Loves Me (but He can't stand you)"

[blue-duncan]

But Bro. Cloud is not speaking the truth in his rant. If you look at the supposed positions, he has created straws for his own myopic position. What BG is saying in 1-6 is he is an Evangelist, not a Theologian or a Pastor so why get mixed up in disputes that can only turn unbelievers away from the Gospel. Notice, in even the cryptic quotes Bro. Cloud uses, there are qualifications that he ignores. Graham, as an Evangelist, going from city to city, nation to nation, culture to culture, must present a message that presents the Gospel in its simplest terms and rely on the work of the Holy Spirit to convict the elect.

As to the versions and translations he uses, so what! The Holy Spirit can convict based on the testimony of a sinner who paraphrases the Word in his own situation. The sending of converts to apostate churches has to be one of the most ridiculous complaints going. Where do you think the converts came from? If he sends them anywhere else he gets no cooperation in his campaigns and the large number of unbelievers would not be encouraged by their apostate Pastors to come. If you say that believers will bring their unsaved friends, then just look at your church and tell us how many were saved last Sunday at the service.

BG is obedient to his calling and trust and is an example of one who truly relies on the Holy Spirit to bring in the harvest.

Those that can, do; those that can't, complain!

[steve-b]

Bro. Cloud lives among the people of Nepal, and certainly writes all of his own books

If this article is an example of his prose style, maybe he should hire himself a ghostwriter.

[righttackle44]

No, no, no.

I said I want YOU to demonstrate the errors in
Billy Graham's theology. Since I don't know you,
I don't know if you have the capacity or love to
see what he is saying, or if you're simply an angry
little fundamentalist who hates everyone who doesn't
believe EXACTLY the way you do. (I've know many of
them in my life.) Or if you are doing this in a
spirit of love and correction.

[xzins]

Your 2 cents is always welcome, dear sister in Christ.

And you are correct.

"With what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again."

Thanks for listening to the Lord.

[Religion Moderator]

Argue the issues all you want - do not make it personal.

[Campion]

Bro. Cloud is a missionary to Nepal, writer, preacher, church planter, great guy.

Ask that "great guy" where he thinks your Catholic aunt is spending eternity.

[xzins]

The following is from BG's crusade in Pasadena Calif in 2004. In it he preaches the "Blood of Christ" as reported by impartial reporters to the Crusade in the Baptist Press News. I'd say that this pretty well discounts the Point #1 of this article you have posted.

Like a grandfather who knew he had limited opportunities to guide future generations, Graham turned his attention to the Gospel message. Using illustrations few in the world could use -- including conversations with former Presidents John F. Kennedy and Ronald Reagan -- Graham encouraged those attending to prepare for Christ's coming by accepting Him into their life.

"Many of you have Christian parents and were raised in a Christian home, but you have this other pull toward the sins of this world," Graham said. "But are you really happy? Something is missing in your life."

The Gospel is the only remedy for that emptiness, Graham said.

"Jesus gave His life, all His scourging, all the nails that went into His hands and feet, they were for you," he said. Jesus shed His blood for you and me."

[opus86]

[yawn] More Graham bashing...The author apparently has too much time on his hands. I've heard Graham on several occasions talk about the necessity of Christ's blood, the virgin birth, and the reality of hell. I doubt I agree with everything Graham's said and done, I probably wouldn't agree with everything Luther, Calvin, Wesley, et al, said and did.

[JohnnyM]

GRAHAM SAYS THE VIRGIN BIRTH NOT A NECESSARY PART OF CHRISTIAN FAITH

A. While I most certainly believe that Jesus Christ was born of a virgin, I do not find anywhere in the New Testament that this particular belief is necessary for personal salvation (“Billy Graham Answers 26 Provocative Questions,” United Church of Observer, July 1, 1966).

The title of the author's charge and what Graham said are two totally different things. Graham said that is was not necessary for salvation. Jesus did not say, believe I was born of a virgin and you will be saved. Now, I would say that beleiving he was born of a virgin is, as the author puts it, a necessary part of the Christian faith, and I am sure that Graham would agree.

There are some things that were quoted by Graham that give me pause, but most of those quotes were from the 60s and I would like to see what he thinks now, before jumping to any conclusions.

JM

[P-Marlowe]

I'm a Christian, a Bible believing baptist.

Do you consider Billy Graham a Christian? Your buddy "Brother" Cloud seems to consider him a false teacher, which would appear to exclude him from the body of Christ.

Do you believe that Catholics can be Christians and still remain as Catholics? Brother Cloud seems to number anyone who even associates with Catholics to be false teachers and hence not part of the Body of Christ.

So lets clear this up, is anyone other than a "Bible Believing" (code word for KJV Onlyer) Baptist a legitimate Christian in your eyes or they eyes of your buddy "Brother" Cloud? Or are all of us infant baptized NKJV (or--gasp--NASB) evangelical protestants and all the Catholics (Orthodox and Roman) headed for hell in a handbasket unless we get on board with you and your Baptist buds?

Why are you calling me a cultist?

You're not a Catholic. You're not a protestant. You seem hung up on claiming that everyone who doesn't think exactly as you do on esoteric spritual matters is a "false teacher" and you call your fellow travelers "Brother".

Hmmmm. Looks like it... smells like it... tastes like it... boy, I'm sure glad I didn't step in it.

[Knitting A Conundrum]

That verse motivates me a lot... the measure you give will be the measure you get.

And then the next verse:

Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?

And sometimes I even remember the story about Jesus writing in the dust and a group of men, ready to lynch a woman dropping their stones as he wrote down the list of their failings (some say), and none without sin...

Sometimes it hits me like a ton of bricks and I kneel down and say, "O God, I am so sorry."

[Frumanchu]

Sounds like a prophecy of what the reformers caused.

I can assure you that the Reformers did not "cause" this.

[nmh]

I could NEVER understand his alliance with Catholics. We don't have the same beliefs. May God open his eyes on atleast that painful apostasy.

[blue-duncan]

"Or are all of us infant baptized"

You never told us you were infant baptized. I always thought you were legimate.