Does God So Love the World? (John MacArthur)

OnePlace.com ^ | July 21, 2005 | John MacArthur

[Dr. Eckleburg]

So you think God has determined what you will be eating for dinner, two months from now?

How can you NOT think that is true?

While it seems like a silly question, it strikes at the heart of who God is. Where do you draw the line? God only concerns Himself with the "bigger" issues and leaves the smaller stuff to us? What's "smaller?"

If there's a God, and if He's the God of all Creation, and if He's the God of the Old and New Testaments, and if He's the God who died Himself for your sins and mine, then, YES, this is the very same God who determines what you'll eat for breakfast two weeks from Sunday.

Thank God. That is wonderful news. Because we are among His elect, because Christ came to gather you and me and return us to His Heavenly presence, we should rejoice in every step that takes us home.

Or else there is no God.

[Frumanchu]

Perhaps...but that was not the case when you made that post, and given that a very small minority of the 60+ members of the GRPL have voiced an opinion either way, I'd say declaring that "most of the GRPLs appear to be coming down on the side of AW Pink and against MacArthur" is at the very least premature.

Anyway, ping-list opinions aside I don't believe his being "the pastor of a megachurch" has anything to do with the difference in opinions.

[P-Marlowe]

Dr. Eck: With concessions like this one, John MacArthur is well on his way to becoming the Bill Frist among the Reformed.

Well Fru, looks like I left out Dr. Eck, who also seems to feel that MacArthur is on the brink of apostacy.

Fru, you and nobodysfool seem to be alone among the GRPL's.

I think MacArthur is well on the way to becoming an honorary neener. Care to join him?

[RnMomof7]

I believe I quoted Pink and said I agreed with him.

[blue-duncan]

"Do you love Saddam Hussein in the same way that you love Mrs. b-d? An unselfish, giving love?"

And would blue-duncan give his life for Saddam Hussein the same way I would assume he would give his life for Mrs. blue-duncan or his children?

Not even close you wise guys. Who do you think I am, Michael Dukakis? All that your questions prove is how far I am from loving as God loves, so there, now you have "outed" me for the sinner I am, saved by grace!

[RnMomof7]

So you think God has determined what you will be eating for dinner, two months from now?

If you lived in Africa you would be praying for HIM to provide you food

"Give us this day our daily bread"

Do you think God does not know or care what people eat? Is it of NO interest to Him?

[ksen]

So you think God has determined what you will be eating for dinner, two months from now?

If God numbers the hairs on my head, and determines our every breath, then I don't find it too much of a stretch to think that He's prepared the menu for my entire life. I know at our table we thank God for His provision and for providing our meals. How could He provide my meals if He didn't decide what to provide?

[Frumanchu]

He took a shot at reformed believers that was unnecessary and served no purpose but to please the likes of those that want to say or imply that we have a misplace zeal.

OR...he was simply using an example to illustrate how one can take the opposite of the "evangelical" view too far by drawing unnecessary conclusions.

That was self serving and mac deserves to have it pointed out it did not escape our notice

Self-serving? Because it was a valid example of the point he was making? I think you are being way too quick to assume motives and pass a rather harsh judgement on him.

[P-Marlowe]

Pink is correct, and MacArthur knows that. IMO MacArthur is now doing penance for his "exclusionary" remarks, here concerning Muslims, and in the following links, where he discusses homosexuals and politics.

This was originally published (by way of his radio program) in 2001. It seems odd that he would have decided to pay penance in 2001 for remarks made in 2005. Don't you think?

[ksen]

You don't believe God capable of this?

Of having two different wills? No, I don't think God has two different wills. I think He is just as bapable of having two sets of wills as He is of creating a square circle.

[RnMomof7]

Self-serving? Because it was a valid example of the point he was making? I think you are being way too quick to assume motives and pass a rather harsh judgement on him.

I think we are called to judge correct doctrine from incorrect.

[Dr. Eckleburg]

MacArthur is playing to the masses.

Ping to 105 and 150.

No one disagrees that the sun shines on the reprobate and the elect alike.

But salvation is more than sunshine.

[stuartcr]

I thought God was all-powerful, and capable of anything...including things that don't seem possible.

[Corin Stormhands]

This was originally published (by way of his radio program) in 2001. It seems odd that he would have decided to pay penance in 2001 for remarks made in 2005. Don't you think?

Ooops...

[P-Marlowe]

The timing of MacArthur's statements here certainly make what you are saying valid.

He originally made these statements in 2001.

Adapted from The God Who Loves © 2001 by John MacArthur. All rights reserved.

[ksen]

I think ksen is on the side of AW Pink. That makes Pink the majority opinion so far.

That's right....I make up a majority. ;^)

Seriously, what is it I'm siding with? I've been paying only a little bit of attention to your discussion with Fru.

[Dr. Eckleburg]

How could He provide my meals if He didn't decide what to provide?

Excellent point.

It always amazes me that some think there are things in life too inconsequential for God to determine.

God can conprehend all of eternity in a single blink of an eye.

[Buggman]

That is wonderful news. Because we are among His elect, because Christ came to gather you and me and return us to His Heavenly presence, we should rejoice in every step that takes us home.

Unless, of course, you aren't really in God's elect, but are simply one of the reprobate who God has predestined to think that you are among the elect so that He might damn you all the more, in accordance with His good pleasure.

Tell me, Doc, if God does not have both an active will, by which He makes things to be, and a passive will, by which He permits things to be even though He would prefer His freewilled creations to make better decisions, why did the Messiah cry out over Jerusalem:

O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one killing the prophets and stoning those who are sent to her, how often would I have gathered your children together, even as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you would not! Behold, your house is left to you desolate. For I say to you, You shall not see Me from now on until you say, "Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord." --Mt. 23:37-39

Hmm . . . based on your false dichotomy ("God [actively] ordains everything, or there is no God!), it seems that the Messiah is claiming that there is no God. Gotta love the rediculous heresies one comes to when one follows GRPL theology to its logical and Scriptural conclusion.

[ksen]

I thought God was all-powerful, and capable of anything...including things that don't seem possible.

God doesn't do logical absurdities.

Can God sin?

[Dr. Eckleburg]

Fru, would you please point out one Calvinist anywhere who says the sun does not shine on the reprobate as well as the elect?